Climate Change - increasingly horrible disasters loom

The most populous country is communist and it's polluting like there is no tomorrow lol

Hmmm ..... so, let's understand how things operate my friend .....

Nature doesn't give a damn about human financial systems. We can't transcend physics and biology.

We've had 5 mass extinctions in the last 450M years and humans are not immune to precipitating a 6th. Extinction is the natural destination of any organism which has no external checks and balances on its population growth. Such an organism is destined to perish in its own toxic waste. We are bacteria in a petri dish. The earth is finite. In the span of a single century we have reconstituted an atmosphere which is >10M years old.

We are triggering Earth System tipping points which are irreversible. The overturning ocean circulation (AMOC) is near a threshold for stoppage for the first time in 13k years. Sea level rise is accelerating and coastal real estate around the world is shifting from perpetuity to annuity. We are adding the equivalent of 1M Hiroshima bomb detonations worth of energy to the ocean every day. Coral reefs are dying en masse.

Humans are playing chicken with an opponent that is bigger than us and has no feelings.

China is much more than "communist". There are lots of billionaires in China. They eat our lunch when it comes to manufacturing efficiency. And a whole lot of that pollution is manufacturing for western consumption. When the accounting system for emissions assigns ALL of the emissions to the country of manufacture and ZERO to the country of consumption ..... we need to maybe take those numbers with a grain.

We do need to treat it like a war but rationing did not win the war. Science, maths and technology won the war along with determined, focused effort and a belief in the future.

We cannot afford mistakes about the earth being finite or ideas like rationing is a solution.

I have to admit that it did start to make a little sense when you stated that we are bacteria in a petri dish.

With that, what solutions do you propose against this opponent that is bigger than us and doesn't have feelings?

If rationing didn't help win the war .... why did we do it ? Why was that policy accepted by the people and why has it not been seen as an historic failure.

Rationing was necessary to win the war. It wasn't the only thing. It was part on an integrated solution.

Mostly we did rationing because germany sunk our shipping (sieges etc in historical times)

Rationing may be required at times but it's part of hanging in their while we win the war. Rationing is not the solution.

To begin with, a sense of humility which helps us understand that we are both part of and subordinate to nature.

Second .... we need to apply MATH to the problem of human industrial waste. A poker community should have a good grasp of math.

Our current global financial system operates on a concept where wealth is measured as the present value of future cash flows called the Time Value Of Money.

The PV of a dollar to be received in the future = 1 / (1 + i)^n

i= interest rate
n = # of periods (such as years)

When you do the math ..... you realize that at a reasonable interest rate (say 5-6% on Treasuries or higher on riskier investments), the only cash flows that matter are those to be received in the next 20-30 years. The global financial system is only concerned with the near future and the ability of the system to be productive beyond that near future is completely ignored.

This system works perfectly fine until you cross a threshold where its possible to destroy the future as a result of surpassing planetary habitability boundaries.

A system such as a carbon tax which caused the emitter to pay for the damage to the future might have been effective if it had been implemented a few decades ago. But its late for that. We need global regulation which protects the future from the narrow priority of short term profit seeking. We need to recognize the rights of future generations to a habitable planet as inalienable.

50% of global emissions come from the wealthiest 10% of the population. We need to disconnect wealth from the privilege to pollute and take away the present unlimited ability to pollute for free. We need to declare a global war on toxic waste and have Manhattan Project level commitment to finding ways to minimize it.

We need to let go of addictions and the idea that anything that makes money is OK. A single bitcoin transaction consumes 1.3 million x as much electricity as a standard credit card transaction. We need people in leadership to say "no ...bitcoin is unnecessary even if the companies who sells the servers necessary for bitcoin will have to take a hit in profit". We need cell phones and PC's that don't need to be replaced every 2-3 years in order to maximize the profit of Microsoft and Apple. We need more durable products. We need to encourage telecommuting. We need more electrified public transit. We will need more local resiliency and food supply as a result of global supply chains being disrupted due to increasingly severe weather. We need foreign policy which tells poor countries that we aren't willing to let them starve. We need to stop investing in real estate construction in places like South Florida which are destined to be claimed by the ocean.

We need to have more global cooperation and the intelligence to not have our brains glaze over when someone yells "socialism".

We need to learn from history at what a world looks like when we are indifferent to the suffering of others. Indifference to the starving of Germans led to the Nazi's, a Holocaust and 60M dead in WW2.

We need to teach people what it means for the overturning ocean circulation to stop. We need to teach them what it would mean for the glaciers in the Himalaya and Hindu-Kush which supply nearly 2B people with water to disappear. We need to teach them what it would mean for coastal communities around the world if sea levels rose 5 feet.

Humans are incredibly intelligent when it comes to their personal short term survival . We are great when it comes to clan identity and loyalty vs other clans. But we suck big time when it comes to global cooperation. We have to do better.

We need an 11th commandment which involves fidelity to the experience of the future. We have a commandment to honor our parents But there is no commandment in the opposite direction. We need to amend our religious beliefs.

Odds are against us. But I'm not clinging to the outcome. I'm just doing my best to explain what we need and letting the chips fall where they may.

I agree with much of that but it lacks the positive vision of what we can achieve for our children and humanities future. Humilty is good but there is a brilliant future to be won for humanity if we fight for it. Defeatism isn't going to cut it.

Yes we need manhaten projects, we need colossus, we need the moon landings. We need it on a different scale. Not just to deal with problems but to make life vastly better for everyone.

Humanity is nothing like bacteria in a petri dish. If we **** it up it will be our own fault.

I think u missed the « philosophical « concept of what he meant .

No I didn't. Humanity is not subservient to nature. Or if we are we are currently an infinitesimal speck in the petri dish.

I've no interest in bitcoin but using it as a proxy for all the good stuff. Sure we need to mitiigate the short term problems and try to buy time. I'm going with a covid analogy so we need masks and lockdowns. The real aim though is cheap clean energy - effectively unlimited virtaully free clean energy. That is the vaccine that we need and that is one area where the manhatten/colossus/moon landings type analogy needs to focus on - with steroids.

Telling people we need to live forever with masks and lockdowns is both false and doomed. The future if were going to win will be awesome and we need to go for it really hard because we're in a deadly race.

If we took climate change seriously, we wouldn't call it "climate change".

Imagine your friend is rushed to the hospital and you get called as their emergency contact. You rush to the hospital and the doctor tells you that your friend has "body change". Imagine your reaction ..... ("what the ****"). This tells you nothing.

The reason your friend is in the hospital is because they drank a bottle of whiskey. The doctor will tell you that your friend has "Blood Alcohol Poisoning".

Blood is the LOCATION of the poison.

Alcohol is the NAME of the poison.

Poisoning is an unequivocal declaration of dangerous toxicity.

That's informative !!!

Climate change should be renamed as Atmospheric Poisoning or Atmospheric Carbon Poisoning (since the primary toxins are excess CO2 and CH4).

If we understood it that way, people would look to understand where the atmospheric carbon comes from and understand that clean energy is only a minority part of the solution. We need to look at agriculture, diet, transportation, industry, land use and recreational behaviors too.

Nut, warming isn't detrimental to the totality of the planet, stop the bullshitting. Some places gain by warming. You want to claim "overall" on earth we are worse off? that's possible. Still it's nothing like poison, it isn't something that is strictly worse for everyone.

STOP THE BULLSHITTING

I'll take that as a poke at my clean energy point

Firtsly I'd agree we need more manhatten/etc on steroid projects than just clean energy. Your behavior points are still masks/lockdowns which are fine as far as they go but must not hide the need for the desperately needed real solutions. In all areas we need advances in science and technology. Once we have the science, it's cheap clean energy that makes implementing them possible.

I think we're coming at this from different perspectives.

We have laws which prohibit disorderly behavior. Laws against killing, stealing, etc. There is no science and technology which gets around those prohibitions. The only right answer is to not do those things.

If someone invents a crypto-currency like Bitcoin which uses 1.3 million x as much electricity as a standard debit card transaction, we don't need a solution which makes that energy clean. We need a solution that says NO, we can't do this until the clean energy alternative is available.

We are poisoning the atmosphere with carbon dioxide. 30,000 lbs per year per average US resident. Our gaseous waste dwarfs our solid waste but we ignore it because we can't see it.

There is no moral system which says it OK to destroy the future, We need a moral government which has the capability to say that some activities are prohibited. The prohibition will provide urgency to come up with solutions. In the absence of that urgency, there is no imperative to stop destroying the future.

Totally agree there is no moral system that says it's ok to destroy the future. Well not one I support anyway.

It's not just bitcoin, it's all recent and future progress that has to be stopped if we dont find real solutions. That's just not going to happen in any reality. We have to pursue the answers with the utmost vigour. Failing to do that is moral negligence imo. Sure lets try to buy time as well but we need to make the maximum use of it.

you are poisoning the internet with leftism, the worst ideology in the history of humanity, this doesn't mean I would be morally justified to block you from doing that. you have a fundamental right to your shitty, disgusting, embarrassing opinion

What I don't get is how pro-lifers (on the right) are OK with roughly 7 million people a year dying from air pollution

Here is an article

Everyone, this is not a clever way to circumvent the personal attacks rule. Don't do this, please. Luciom will rejoin us in 24 hours. ♥

How do you define leftism ?

Is all of the citizens in a community sharing the cost of paving the roads an example of leftism ? Is sharing the cost of a police force and a fire department an example of leftism ? Is sharing the cost of border security an example of leftism ? Are antitrust laws an example of leftism ? How about laws against pollution ?

Would you like to have a substantive interaction or do you prefer name calling as a way to interact ?

Don’t worry , everything that is far right libertarian or fascism is leftish .
No centered view and context have its place in his views .

You don’t seem to understand how humans are actually pretty dependent on the eco system for survival purpose .
That is what is the threat ,it has nothing to do with : « yo man , we gain 3degrees for less harsh winter in northern countries , so cool … »

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Septic tanks in parts of Miami are failing due to rising seas

lots of stinky non functioning toilets and putrid smelling homes

it will cost billions to fix the problem and it's a very slow process

https://archive.ph/T8xWH

Last June when NYC and the surrounding area was covered in an orange haze from the Canadian "wildfires", it was said to be caused by "Climate Change".

However, what a lot of people don't know is all these fires started simultaneously at the exact same time over an area of hundreds of miles. How's that even possible? I mean it's not like I'm tryna be a conspiracy theorist or anything but it's almost like someone used lasers from planes or satellites to ignite them.

This is an actual radar video from Eastern Canada when all the fires mysteriously appeared last year

Solver says this is a pure call.