The costs of trans visibility

it had been weaponized into being an insult to dismiss them as crazies - the mods definitely overreacted but I understand why they did that

Sad to come to this thread and see this delegitimization and weaponizing of mental health struggles. Trying to get a comparison to lobotomies of all things as your analogy....like you get how that is - at best - incredibly insensitive right?

sure but aside from that, what specific issues do you have with the statement?

please don't ghost like the last time i asked for clairification

Well lobotomies were experimental that the medical community got behind till they realized what a horrible mistake it was just as what will be the case in 10-15 years reference gender affirming surgery on minors and puberty blockers .

So for some the analogy is relevant

It has nothing to do with that

It has everything to do with the discussion we were having though.

The one where you said that Turing killed himself for being trans and then I was like "I thought Turing was gay" and you were like "he was but so what" and I was like "but you just said he killed himself for being trans".

I think this is the most cutting thing that I said and though the topic of pronouns was brought up by you, it wasn't meant to be lobbed at you. I thought it was adequately phrased to not be viewed as an attack on you and if it wasn't, that's my mistake. For clarity's sake, I was intentional with my turn of phrase here. I wanted something more cutting than 'jerk'. I don't believe that most *******s in my described situation are horrible people. I believe most *******s don't know they're being *******s. I believe most *******s change their ******* behavior after a point of negative feedback.

To your question, I don't think that I have, but I will. You're an exhausting person to interact with. You're clearly super sensitive but ask others to take your jokes on the chin, your posts are self important while being quick to dismiss others, and it's all just way too long

this should win an award in passive aggressive skirting of the insult rules

you still haven't addressed anything i wrote, just an ad hominem attack cleverly obfuscated in word salad

you don't back up anything you say and call me sensitive over asking people to show their work after they insult me - you sure I'm the super sensitive one here?

simple fact is your believes do not hold water when tested with logic and confirmation bias forces you down this path because otherwise you may have to reconsider your stance - but you can't because you've already decided that's the morally correct stance - so facts be damned, gotta make this like religion with faith and attacks of the nonbelievers

this is what he does, he's never going to go back there and address this, he got caught his pants down and he's going to ignore it - just like when asked for clairification on his accusations of white surpremacy he both claims he didn't say that while also doubling down on it - then when he repeatedly says I lie about everything, i asked him repeatedly to name a single lie and he slinked away with the "i will document them"

these are people used to communicating in a polarized world where it's either within an uber recpective and supportive echo chamber or against some genuinely awful people who are not engaging in good faith

they thus do not have any clear nor coherent arguments because they've never been put in a real situation in the wild where they were required to hold up to any questioning - thus they default to the "hateful bigoted transphobe" and that's their only response to anything

afterall, you're just a transphobe so who cares right?

I can't, I'm exhausted. I didn't obfuscate anything. I very directly said that I am insulting you in the above post

What a weird response. It's like you have predetermined outrage responses and you couldn't find an appropriate one. Nice edit to your post...

you're halfway there, so close to standing up and saying it directly

too bad you feel the need to throw this in front of it

just own it

don't dance around in word salad and very transparently faux apologies

if you're going to to discuss facts on a fact for fact basis then do so, if you're going to just dance around in vague generalities with strong insinuations of personal attack then don't bother

glad you at least admitted what you've been doing, you earned back a modicum of respect with that - always been a fan of yours previously (mostly because I love your avatar)

my edit added statements, i didn't delete anything (timelines also clearly show it was before i would have seen your response as well)

a mod can confirm that

nice attempt at character assassination though, with all your practice at it in this thread you'll probably get pretty good at it eventually

I honestly can't take you seriously after that edit

what did i edit?

we've been over this, edit reords are clear and a mod can confirm whatever it is you are implying I did

just say it

what did i edit?

and c'mon you were never taking me seriously

We've been over this? You must have a lot of argumentative history stored with other people that you're confusing with me.

If you look to the post that I quoted, I would say that you have mischaracterized my past interactions with you. You're telling me to own up to past actions which I've willfully opened myself to being judged on in last post and sincerely was not meant to insult you. I then followed that up by insulting you

It's also a gag for you to tell me to own up to my own actions when you edited a further mischaracterization of my actions once I've responded to how big of a gag it was

again, stop with the vague accusations

i told you i didn't delete a single thing, i expanded upon it and added some lines

we can have a mod check this, i have no idea whatsoever wtf you are going on about because it's honestly all in your head - i neither changed nor removed anything, i added some lines because i didn't think what i originally wrote was clear enough - i do that a lot - usually it's fast enough that it doesn't get the edited tag

frankly, the fact that you're still unwilling to actually say what it was makes me feel like this isn't in your head, you saw the "edited" tag on the post and just went for a cheap swipe figuring you could get away with yet another baseless character assassination and had no plan for how to respond when called out on it

I actually do see it now. A mod can check and I'll apologize if I was wrong, that's no problem. In the event that I was blindly rage posting, I'm happy to be checked on it. In any case, seeing it now relieves a lot of tension for me. It was a very **** cherry on this **** sundae

EDIT: It is a clear mischaracterization of the post that you're responding to

why don't you just say what it was? seriously????

Thought this bit was removed

Ok, this thread is now more about each other than about trans issues. Continuing in this fashion would make the thread totally out of control, so please all take a break and reset. If you don't like what someone is saying, you are free to just not respond.

Also, saying "being transgender in and of itself is a mental illness" is not allowed as it's 1) not felt to be true by mental health experts, 2) offensive to trans people by denying their identity, and 3) unproductive for conversation that isn't just insults.

Serendipitous timing

Nevermind.... Deleting my post was poor moderating.

and you're sure i'm the one who is being overly sensitive now

you repeatedly insult me, you're seeing things that don't exist

when asked to clarify or at least explain your slander upon me you refuse repeatedly and even double down that it happened and the entire time if you just looked at the post again, you'd see i was telling the truth and hadn't edited/deleted anything

you also said you'd apologize when it was proven your accusation was incorrect, which never happened, i guess it's a half apology for you to admit it was not deleted, but then again you also needed to get ahead of that before a mod confirmed i didn't remove anything... which would have been a much worse outcome

c'mon man, and you still think I'm the villain here don't you?

and baseless accusations of white supremacy and other insults are still ok then?

speaks volumes that you ignored the dozens of personal attacks and insults and only focused on this

The minimal (literally one) studies we have show that Thai LGBTQ attempt suicide at a profoundly reduced rate to studies in the USA. Literally more than a 50% reduction in % of attempted suicide from polled individuals. I dunno about you, but thats significant to me. Continually pushing that social acceptance plays no part in the well being of Trans individuals is not just wrong, its outright harmul.

This is at least the 2nd and likely the 3rd time I am saying this

i'm with you that 80% contemplate & 40% attempt is worse than 50% contemplate and 20% attempt, no disagreement there

i'm saying that both numbers are still absurdly high

furthermore, asian suicide rates in general are significantly lower than in the west so that could another major factor as well given that you also have a roughly 50% lower rate in the general population as well - hence why i'm not convinced the correlation is as strong as some argue here

i feel like we're looking at this very differently