Ukraine-Russia War Take 2
Here is what the preliminary take on the Ukraine thread disappearing is:
The site was hit with a massive spam attack where hundreds of spam threads were created. In the case where, for example, I see a single spam thread and delete it, that is called a soft delete, and mods can still see them but forum members cannot. Those deletion can be undone.
When a massive attack hits with hundreds of threads, an admin uses a different procedure where the hundreds of spam threads are merged and then hard deleted, where the threads are gone, and no note is left behind. As I have mentioned with my own experience of just soft deleting a large number of posts, sometimes a post or thread gets checked or merged accidentally and is deleted by mistake. Dealing with hundreds of spam threads takes a sledgehammer, not a scalpel.
It appears that our Ukraine thread may have gotten caught up in that recent net of spam threads. If so, it is likely gone for good. I cant say this for sure, and am awaiting comments from admins on this issue. Yes, this sucks. And hopefully there was some other software glitch that caused the disappearance, and we may recover it in the future.
But in the meantime, I have created this new Ukraine-Russia War thread to enable the conversation to continue. Obviously continuity with earlier discussions will be lost. There is no way around that. So as best as possible, let's pick up the conversation with recent events and go from there.
If you have any questions about this, please post them in the mod thread, not here. Let's keep this thread going with posts about the war, not the disappearance of the old thread.
Thanks.
Ok well, I’m new here and I don’t know what to do if you just ignore me so I guess do whatever you want
Unfortunately that's how this forum has been run for awhile now. I am not ignoring you. If you'd like to hear my suggestions for how these problems, I will gladly type them up again.
As I said, ignoring them has only led to them becoming worse over time.
guy, i already said that my confusion/surprise/whatever was because i noticed you posting non-stop about ukraine in 2 separate threads on a dead poker forum and just assumed that you were ukranian and was like ok whatever, makes sense, and then today i finally saw your location and was like wtf. anyway hope you're finally satisfied with this unnecessarily long explanation of the same thing
ok, per mod request and my lack of interest, i'm done. bye. have fun
I'm not your guy, friend.
Thanks for finally explaining it, for the first time. Good contributions.
I missed it. In what ways did Ukraine participate in bringing on this war? I'm too many pages behind.
What's the 100 foot view?
Unfortunately due to "firehose of falsehood" method of spreading propaganda that Russia employs, and is constantly amplified ITT, it's hard to give a 100 foot view:
RAND researchers have characterized Moscow's approach to propaganda as “the firehose of falsehood” because of two distinctive features: high numbers of channels and messages and a shameless willingness to disseminate partial truths or outright fictions.
Here's a good overview of the many false narratives being thrown out. The main one echoed ITT is dehumanizing Ukrainians as Nazis, even despite the fact that Russian is more Nazi-like in every sense of the word. Second would be the bizarre notion that by defending themselves against genocide and Russia's imperialist invasion, Ukrainians are somehow the warmongers. Third is the "short skirt tankie". Overall most of this list has made it into these threads in some shape or form though:
Really, the Nazi thing is still the lead reason? That's amazIng to me.
It is amazing. Despite being constantly debunked, it keeps getting repeated. It's such a powerful word that if someone is even accused of being a Nazi they are ok to subject to Nazi-esque actions apparently.
Even some people who acknowledge that the neo-Nazi influence in Ukraine is minor, in the low single digits, for some reason think that is enough to subject the entire population to Nazi-esque actions. I've asked for it to be removed from this thread the way the first moderator was doing, but so far I've been ignored.
Anyways it's an odd time in the war right now. With the USA aid bill passed Ukraine is in a far better position than they were a short time ago, but it's still looking grim. F-16s likely to arrive in June or July. Despite previous claims that they are the "single weapon that will win this war", I think that they'll be pretty minor in 2024 and 2025. We'll see.
The actual made up reason is nato encroachment on Russia
**** Russia
Single weapon that COULD win the war
Will help them win
Doesn’t mean will win
If we use f16s we use them to rule the sky and then attack ground targets
How will they be used? To test out weapons and tactics against Russia but we won’t fully commit
Can you be more specific please? What targets do you think they'll be used against?
I find it extremely unlikely that Ukraine will "rule the sky" in this conflict.
the us will not release F16s in full combat capability unless we own the skies. I dont know how many other ways to explain this to you
You seem to be indicating you've explained that to me before, but I don't see where.
Let's try this again. Can you be as precise as possible and answer what you think F16s will be doing in 2024 if they end up being used by Ukraine?
You seem to be indicating you've explained that to me before, but I don't see where.
Let's try this again. Can you be as precise as possible and answer what you think F16s will be doing in 2024 if they end up being used by Ukraine?
no idea. being used isnt specific enough to meet the criteria where I can give you an accurate answer.
heres a list of missiles/bombs we can use.
Air-to-air missiles:
6 × AIM-9 Sidewinder
6 × AIM-120 AMRAAM
6 × IRIS-T
6 × Python-4
6 × Python-5
2 × AIM-7 Sparrow[292][293] and 4 × AIM-9 Sidewinder
Air-to-surface missiles:
6 × AGM-65 Maverick
2 × AGM-88 HARM
AGM-158 JASSM (JASSM)
4 × AGM-154 Joint Standoff Weapon (JSOW)
Anti-ship missiles:
2 × AGM-84 Harpoon
4 × AGM-119 Penguin
Joint Strike Missile (to be integrated)
Bombs:
8 × CBU-87 Combined Effects Munition
8 × CBU-89 Gator mine
8 × CBU-97 Sensor Fuzed Weapon
4 × Mark 84 general-purpose bombs
8 × Mark 83 GP bombs
12 × Mark 82 GP bombs
8 × GBU-39 Small Diameter Bomb (SDB)
4 × GBU-10 Paveway II
6 × GBU-12 Paveway II
4 × GBU-24 Paveway III
4 × GBU-27 Paveway III
4 × Joint Direct Attack Munition (JDAM) series
Wind Corrected Munitions Dispenser (WCMD)
B61 nuclear bomb
B83 nuclear bomb
Others:
ADM-160 MALD[291]
SUU-42A/A flares/infrared decoys dispenser pod and chaff pod or
AN/ALQ-131 & AN/ALQ-184 ECM pods on centerline or
LANTIRN, Lockheed Martin Sniper XR & Litening targeting pods or
AN/ASQ-213 HARM targeting system (HTS) Pod (typically configured on station 5L with Sniper XR pod on station 5R) or
Up to 3 × 300/330/370/600 US gallon Sargent Fletcher drop tanks for ferry flight/extended range/loitering time or
UTC Aerospace DB-110 long range EO/IR sensor pod on centerline
What kind of missions do you think F16s will be flying in 2024?
none if we dont rule the sky, is this hard for you to understand?
the US doesnt release air assets to areas where we dont control the skies. part of this is cause we gave stingers to the afghanis.
you keep asking me these questions when you refuse understand that F16s wont do anything in combat zones unless its safe
is it safe? no? no f16s
is it safe? yes? f16s
unless the US uses them to secure the skies ofc but I already said I dont see that happening
So you are saying that F16s will not be allowed to fly over Ukraine?
Are you aware of the present situation in Ukraine? Instead of answering "if it's like this", just use your own personal assessment of the situation in Ukraine. Determine for yourself if you think it is "safe" or "not safe". If Ukraine will "rule the sky" or not.
Given your current assessment of the situation in Ukraine, how do you think F16s will be used in 2024?
very sparingly and only enough to convince the media that F16s are doing a great job protecting Ukraine
how they could be used is completely different.
I think they will be used mostly to help Ukraine's struggling air defenses, in other words chasing down missiles. They will also do some limited HARM and an occasional attack on Russian artillery, which will be extremely dangerous.
chasing down cruise missiles?
Could be other missiles too, but yes.
Not allowed by russia. Thats what hes saying. It makes sense.
They will all be taken down by russia.
Or by the pilots themselves who cant even fly them properly.
Without air superiority these jets make no sense whatsover. Like actually notjing here makes sense...
