IS it now ok go buy datamined hands?
that time of year again, with so many good huds now a days it feels a few of them are worth only if you datamine, so I wanna buy, but is it still not kosher?
link to old thread
https://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/29/ne...
i believe mason malmuth wrote a chapter in his new book on this, you should either buy it or participate in his free kindle giveaway to find the answers you're looking for
Sh*t posting about Sh*t posters, i liek it. 
I guess its not
morally seems okay to me. I mean its not cheating.
Poker is funny too, sometimes the data mined hands will backfire
and lead you astray.
No it's cheating, but online is ruined anyway so just do it.
Really is it cheating.
So if you write on paper 20 hand histories and give me the paper.
I have the paper when I play, thats cheating?
if you do the same live and hand me some info on a player is that cheating
I'm not sure I agree its cheating
Might say its cheating in the aggreement with the site but the sites just write rules
to hopefully make everyone lose equally
Really is it cheating.
So if you write on paper 20 hand histories and give me the paper.
I have the paper when I play, thats cheating?
if you do the same live and hand me some info on a player is that cheating
I'm not sure I agree its cheating
Might say its cheating in the aggreement with the site but the sites just write rules
to hopefully make everyone lose equally
Not sure how anyone who grinds online can think it's not cheating. It's an insane advantage if used correctly.
And lol at comparing it to giving a friend info on a live player or live table.
Pokerstars
Tools and Services Prohibited at All Times
...
The practice of datamining hands or private results (observing games without playing in order to build up a database of hand histories for future reference); the use of hands or private results acquired through datamining; the mass sharing of hands, private results or playing statistics for the purpose of analysis of opponents.
...
So, it is prohibited. Thus, anyone doing it is cheating.
Baal_en_ciaga is that you?
the thing is Im pretty sure, most regs buy hhs, then theres stables where everyone shares hhs. when Im playing I go under the presumption that they have 100k hands on me. but it pisses me off that stars dont do anything about it.
if you play football, you could say its like watching a video of the team your playing next sunday, is it cheating? no
if its online it should be fair game, but its not for the people with ethics, if sites dont want it, they should do something to monitor regs, or just let it be fair game
that time of year again, with so many good huds now a days it feels a few of them are worth only if you datamine, so I wanna buy, but is it still not kosher?
link to old thread
https://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/29/ne...
Buy buy buy, I don't personally but if you want to do it yourself then go ahead. Some may call you a cheater but in this day in age you'll still be on the bottom rung of the ladder when it comes to cheating 😉
Idk but i'd like to hear Brian Hastings take on this.
it never was and never will be
Makes sense why you're asking this.
My guess would be less than 10% of regs are buying HHs, but if you've managed to convince yourself it's like 3/4s, then go ahead. Everyone is doing it and it's standard (apparently). Don't have to feel like you're cheating now, do you?
No. If it were like Chess where all games are available to the entire population, then I think it's a different conversation.
My guess would be less than 10% of regs are buying HHs, but if you've managed to convince yourself it's like 3/4s, then go ahead. Everyone is doing it and it's standard (apparently). Don't have to feel like you're cheating now, do you?
The number obviously depends on the definition of "reg". If you expand "buy" to "share hands with each other" the 3/4 number might not be far off for players who are part of some kind of study group or stable. For everyone else it might actually be closer to 0% than 10%.
FWIW, that might be a topic where people might also have different opinions based on if they played (and bought HHs) at a time when it wasn't against TOS yet. Same as ghosting which wasn't illegal back in the day.
The number obviously depends on the definition of "reg". If you expand "buy" to "share hands with each other" the 3/4 number might not be far off for players who are part of some kind of study group or stable. For everyone else it might actually be closer to 0% than 10%.
FWIW, that might be a topic where people might also have different opinions based on if they played (and bought HHs) at a time when it wasn't against TOS yet. Same as ghosti
I agree it's impossible to know
I will just say, without datamining websites we would've never found out about the GG superusers
Pokerstars
Tools and Services Prohibited at All Times
...
The practice of datamining hands or private results (observing games without playing in order to build up a database of hand histories for future reference); the use of hands or private results acquired through datamining; the mass sharing of hands, private results or playing statistics for the purpose of analysis of opponents.
...
So, it is prohibited. Thus, anyone doing it is cheating.
If it violates the TOS on one site and does not violate the TOS on another, is it cheating or not?
If it violates the TOS on one site and does not violate the TOS on another, is it cheating or not?
I agree its more grey area.
I think many of you are overestimating its advantage.
I used to use HUD's but don't anymore because Party poker doesn't allow.
But made me realize I was looking at those numbers too much, and making mistakes
by making decisions based on numbers, and perhaps ignoring game flow.
There's so many regs in today's game also. Not like there numbers are very different
from one to the next.
