Israel/Palestine thread
Think this merits its own thread...
Discuss my fellow 2+2ers..
AM YISRAEL CHAI.
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So is that true it's a 10 year truce and they still insist their ultimate goal is to have Israel no longer exist? If so it's a bit of a non starter.
why is it a non starter? seems like a big deal.
yes
Right but once Israel is gone then they don't want to kill Jews anymore. Pinky promise apparently.
yes
wrong
yes
Oh right, they just say they’ll remove “Zionists” now.
Get real. They just want to remove and kill all the Jews in the region. Even they don’t bother denying this.
wrong
So ideally, the refugees cross borders into places where they can be safe, fed, etc.
I don't know how this would work for countries that would see their populations increase by 30% or more from it (and let's be honest that would create a near collapse for many countries). Like 100m South Americans busting into the USA if climate change gets real bad is a hell of a concept to consider.
But this is the closest thing to an answer that I've see
South America is full of mountainous countries with people living at elevation. If climate change "gets really bad" you'd see more people wanting to escape to there, not from there.
South America is full of mountainous countries with people living at elevation. If climate change "gets really bad" you'd see more people wanting to escape to there, not from there.
Depends on if climate changes disrupts the crops you use to eat.
No more crops, no more eat. Time to beat feet north
I don't think it's too much to ask by Israel that their neighbors acknowledge and respects that their country exists. I think that's more of a start. I guess Hamas sees that as admitting they are defeated but news flash, they've been defeated for the last 50 years or so.
I don't think it's too much to ask by Israel that their neighbors acknowledge and respects that their country exists. I think that's more of a start. I guess Hamas sees that as admitting they are defeated but news flash, they've been defeated for the last 50 years or so.
Is Israel obligated to acknowledge and respect that Palestine exists?
I'm sure they do acknowledge the area called Palestine exists. There is currently no sovereign nation called that, so that is impossible to do.
Were a two state solution finalized and implemented, I would expect Israel's respect of the new state would be required by the agreement.
The recognition argument is stupid. In exchange for a 10 year truce, should Israel stop blockading Gaza? Of course. Stop building settlements in the WB? Of course. Stop policing the connections between Palestinian areas in the WB? Of course. And probably 99% of the WB could be returned with barely moving any Israelis. Almost all the settler population is right on the border.
What should Palestinians have to do for Israel to stop occupation? The only reasonable requirement is to not shoot rockets and such.
The Hague can come apprehend the Nazi war criminals. gl with that
The recognition argument is stupid. In exchange for a 10 year truce, should Israel stop blockading Gaza? Of course. Stop building settlements in the WB? Of course. Stop policing the connections between Palestinian areas in the WB? Of course. And probably 99% of the WB could be returned with barely moving any Israelis. Almost all the settler population is right on the border.
What should Palestinians have to do for Israel to stop occu
Israel will probably never give up east Jerusalem and would want to keep most of area c. That is what makes me doubtful of an agreement
Israel and Egypt BOTH decided to blockade gaza when terrorists took over. They BOTH do it for National Security reasons. If and when we can have non-terrorists running gaza, and the likelihood of terrorists taking over becomes miniscule, then and only them should the border control stop
Which is why this war cannot stop until they destroy hamas in gaza
Destroying Hamas is a requirement designed by people who don't want peace. Menachim Begin blew up hotels. Nelson Mandela bombed a bar. You negotiate with who is there and you don't expect people to stop fighting until after the agreement to stop fighting.
And of course there won't be an agreement, not for a long time.
There seems to be an israeli narrative that they have a right to exist, regardless of war crimes, on other's land for perpetuity. The facts regarding these crimes, including ethnic cleansing and genocide are now coming out at the international level.
South Africa is trying here people.
I hope it isn't antisemitic to point out some of what we have learned.
3 of the 85 pages so far presented are direct quotes from israeli leaders with ethnic cleansing and genocidal intent. This is important.
Bombing a population with nowhere to go and then bombing the 'safe' zones for those who make it that far.
2/3 of all structures in Northern Gaza and 60 percent of all residential homes no longer exist. This coincides with the displacement of nearly 2 million people.
Strategic targeting in the air and on the ground of government buildings, places of worship, libraries, food mills, stores and record archives.
Almost complete inhalation of all healthcare including hospitals, ambulances international doctors and nurses. The deaths resulting from withholding medicine and power alone are staggering.
Deliberate and admitted starvation tactics.
The worst humanitarian crisis in modern history and it's estimated that 80 percent of global famine is currently in Gaza.
Documented cases of idf executing civilians on the ground including the case of the Israeli hostages, the storming of Al-Shifa leaving infants to die, bulldozing bodies and homes, humiliating, kidnapping and torturing civilians, destroying shops and homes
ON HOSTAGES: >7,000 Palestinians are currently being held hostage, many without trial or charges.
The deaths cannot be counted and over 10,000 children are unaccounted for.
Textbook genocide according to this (Israeli) expert on the subject.
Israel will probably never give up east Jerusalem and would want to keep most of area c. That is what makes me doubtful of an agreement
Israel and Egypt BOTH decided to blockade gaza when terrorists took over. They BOTH do it for National Security reasons. If and when we can have non-terrorists running gaza, and the likelihood of terrorists taking over becomes miniscule, then and only them should the border control stop
Which is why this w
how do you destroy hamas exactly? you guys have a list of every enlisted and enrolled member?
do you count as a hamas member an 11 year old boy who saw his mother and sister get killed recently?
Does anyone here dispute that the IDF is systematically targeting journalists? The death toll is above 70, right?
it was above 110 last I saw. but some sources count it differently.
like when they finally murder this guy, I doubt the West will classify him as a journalist but hes got a million followers.
Does anyone here dispute that the IDF is systematically targeting journalists? The death toll is above 70, right?
How many journalists are in Gaza?
1% of the population has been killed. If there are 7000 journalists in Gaza then they are being killed in proportion to their numbers. If you account for them being more likely to be in places getting bombed than average people, then probably with 2 or 3 thousand journalists you'd expect 70 to be killed.
How many journalists are in Gaza?
1% of the population has been killed. If there are 7000 journalists in Gaza then they are being killed in proportion to their numbers. If you account for them being more likely to be in places getting bombed than average people, then probably with 2 or 3 thousand journalists you'd expect 70 to be killed.
Your point being that 3,000 is a preposterous number of journalists and the numbers clearly suggest targeting?
Unrelated but I like it:
how do you destroy hamas exactly? you guys have a list of every enlisted and enrolled member?
do you count as a hamas member an 11 year old boy who saw his mother and sister get killed recently?
The state will need to be occupied for some time
If not by Israel, maybe a neutral party like Saudi
But there is no way Israel stops the blockade without being comfortable with their safety
