The costs of trans visibility

The costs of trans visibility

Yesterday, Dylan Mulvaney broke her silence: https://www.tiktok.com/@dylanmulvaney/vi....

For context, this is a trans influencer who built a 10 million strong following on TikTok. She took a brand deal with budweiser to post an ad on an instagram, and the anti-trans right went absolutely ballistic, calling for a boycott, condemning the company, and to some perhaps unknowable degree it influenced that Budweiser sales dropped by a 1/4 and

. Dylan speaks more personally about the effect of the hatred on her.

What strikes me about this story is that it is just about visibility. This isn't inclusion in sports or gender-affirming care for minors, it was just that a trans person was visible. This wasn't even visibility in a TV commerical that a poor right-winger is forced to see, it was an ad on her own instagram page. We're all in our own social media algorithm influenced bubbles, but from my vantage point it really has seemed that in the last year or so things have just gotten worse for trans people and the backlash to even minor visibility is growing.

We need to do better.

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30 June 2023 at 04:48 PM
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by ganstaman P

I can only easily speak to the ability of a minor to consent to certain medical care in New Jersey, so I don't know if this is just an exception (in terms of activity and state) or just an example of something more broad.

https://lis.njleg.state.nj.us/nxt/gatewa...
"The consent to the provision of medical or surgical care [...] when executed by a minor who is or believes that he or she may have a sexually transmitted in

Thanks for your info. I wouldn't put those things in the same category as trans related hormones or surgery, but it is relevant.


by Doorbread P

What are you claiming to be a 'natural phenomenon'? I would think the true figure in the past was also unnaturally suppressed. In any case, there are a ton of logical reasons you can point to to note an increase in young people who identify that actually exist. People are pointing to 'indoctrination' by educators with no actual examples. All it really takes is one example to bring an angry old to orgasm anyway

For clarity's sake it would als

Ye all Kids everywhere in the world were master spies capable of hiding their belief they were of the opposite sex to everyone in their life, forever.

OR, the disastrous policies the left enacted convinced a decent number of people with non standard sexuality to actually be trans


by BrianTheMick2 P

All the cool kids belonged to satanic cults in the 1980s, so there is precedence for this sort of freaking out over nothing.

Society once freaked out about acid rain, so the whole concept of climate change is a complete fraud right?


by Luciom P

Ye all Kids everywhere in the world were master spies capable of hiding their belief they were of the opposite sex to everyone in their life, forever.

OR, the disastrous policies the left enacted convinced a decent number of people with non standard sexuality to actually be trans

I think child spies (sneaky kids hiding their feelings from their parents!) and policy shifts actually brings us to a closer and more honest representation of why these numbers change than indoctrination in school, so you're inadvertently stumbling into a point here

Spies only one moving part to a larger cultural shift of course


by chillrob P

I'm pretty sure just as many people care about my opinion as about your opinion.

I didn't bring up that as an example, you did, apparently thinking it was some kind of gotcha, but it's not. Didn't prove anything, except that you don't have to be a bigot to oppose these kinds of surgeries for minors.

I agree with you, my opinion doesn't matter either because I am not the patient or family member.

Name a medical procedure other than abortion, gender affirming care, birth control or cosmetic procedures that you and society feel you have a right to interject your beliefs into the decision making process.


by Luciom P

Ye all Kids everywhere in the world were master spies capable of hiding their belief they were of the opposite sex to everyone in their life, forever.

OR, the disastrous policies the left enacted convinced a decent number of people with non standard sexuality to actually be trans

Also the idea that a larger % of children who identified as Trans weren't hiding or lacking the ability to comprehend their feelings way back when seems... off


by Luciom P

Society once freaked out about acid rain, so the whole concept of climate change is a complete fraud right?

Ummm. Acid rain was an actual problem that we (mostly) solved by reducing sulfur dioxide and nitrogen oxide emissions.

The satanic panic was an actual fake problem that we solved by ridiculing the right wing nutters who were freaking out.

One of the two is directly analogous.


by BrianTheMick2 P

Ummm. Acid rain was an actual problem that we (mostly) solved by reducing sulfur dioxide and nitrogen oxide emissions.

The satanic panic was an actual fake problem that we solved by ridiculing the right wing nutters who were freaking out.

One of the two is directly analogous.

lol acid rain was an actual problem roflmao


by jjjou812 P

I agree with you, my opinion doesn't matter either because I am not the patient or family member.

Name a medical procedure other than abortion, gender affirming care, birth control or cosmetic procedures that you and society feel you have a right to interject your beliefs into the decision making process.

everything we pay for, directly or indirectly.

if you pay you have a say.

abolish all socialism in healthcare,make it like food, where every one buys what he wants with his money without subsidies, and we are good.

you want any money from me I get a full right to decide when, if, how, why it is spent in full detail


by Luciom P

everything we pay for, directly or indirectly.

if you pay you have a say.

abolish all socialism in healthcare,make it like food, where every one buys what he wants with his money without subsidies, and we are good.

you want any money from me I get a full right to decide when, if, how, why it is spent in full detail

I would guess you would also be against government subsidies to farmers, correct?

When you say that you want a say if you pay, isn't that what the elective representatives are for? Or do you believe somehow you should be consulted personally? Let's say you paid $20k in taxes. That doesn't actually by itself fund much of anything. So if you expect details, if they could say "well your 20k was used to buy 10% of a single $2 million cruise missile so you don't get any say in any other aspect of the defense budget and no say about any other policy or program bc you didn't pay for any of those, is that ok? Or do you think your $20k somehow gives you a right to determine where a trillion dollars of stuff goes?


by browser2920 P

I would guess you would also be against government subsidies to farmers, correct?

When you say that you want a say if you pay, isn't that what the elective representatives are for? Or do you believe somehow you should be consulted personally? Let's say you paid $20k in taxes. That doesn't actually by itself fund much of anything. So if you expect details if they could say "well your 20k was used to buy 10% of a single $2 million cruise miss

should we play this game again? a guy writes that "who am I to say what I want for medical procedures on others".

I answer u ****ing pay for them so I have a right to talk.

someone else comes and says "it's a representative democracy so you actually don't matter".

wait a sec. my point was just that I could express what I think should be cover and what shouldn't with my money. then ofc I hope my representatives pick up this preference and legislate accordingly.

which, guess what, they somewhat are doing in some jurisdictions.

I would prefer no healthcare had ever anything to do with any political choice. no subsidies. given I live in a world where the majority wants to pay for healthcare for everyone's then I talk about what is worthy of coverage and what isn't.


by Luciom P

should we play this game again? a guy writes that "who am I to say what I want for medical procedures on others".

I answer u ****ing pay for them so I have a right to talk.

someone else comes and says "it's a representative democracy so you actually don't matter".

wait a sec. my point was just that I could express what I think should be cover and what shouldn't with my money. then ofc I hope my representatives pick up this preference and legis

Ok. I took your post wrong then. Of course everyone can express their opinion. I was responding to your statement that you have the right to decide, rather than just express an opinion. That's a big difference.

you want any money from me I get a full right to decide when, if, how, why it is spent in full detail


by Luciom P

lol acid rain was an actual problem roflmao

Ummmm. It is settled science. You might be surprised to learn that the sun rising in the east is also settled science.

This might not be too complicated for you to understand: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Acid_rain#....

I can help you read through it, if you'd like. Make sure to check out the section on "controversies" on the page. It doesn't happen to exist, which is kind of a hint.


by Luciom P

You mean the biggest genocide of american history, more YLL than COVID, more YLL than the civil war, more YLL than the trail of tears.

It wasn't the "overuse of painkiller". It was (and still is) the willful assassination of young adults / middle aged working class Americans (mostly whites but not exclusively)

That is actually ok. We aren't in any danger of running out of pasty people, so it is far from genocide. Plus, it primarily took out the weakest of the master race, improving things for our future.

As a fellow pasty person, I can say that sort of thing.

I reject any stories about some weak-ass white person with a bad back getting on heroin after a stint with Purdue Pharma's junk. If they were a halfway decent white person, they would not have had a bad back in the first place or not do some dumbass job such as being a coal miner. They are weak and they need to be culled for the good of the race. This isn't indiscriminate slaughter - it is necessary and good slaughter of the weak.

(In case my satire isn't obvious, I think it is really weird that you mentioned the plight of the white people. There is literally no plight.)


by BrianTheMick2 P

That is actually ok. We aren't in any danger of running out of pasty people, so it is far from genocide. Plus, it primarily took out the weakest of the master race, improving things for our future.

As a fellow pasty person, I can say that sort of thing.

I reject any stories about some weak-ass white person with a bad back getting on heroin after a stint with Purdue Pharma's junk. If they were a halfway decent white person, they would not h

sure white life expectancy in the USA is the lowest of any white majority country (and the only one significantly decreasing post COVID) in the world even if the USA spends more than any country in the world in healthcare per person but there is no plight.

everything is fine as it is, china isn't pushing fentanyl in the USA and in the USA only even if the Biden admin explicitly says so, assassinating 60k+ working age American per year (mostly white), everything is perfect.


by Luciom P

everything we pay for, directly or indirectly.

if you pay you have a say.

if I apply you test, what payments are you making into the American or Canadian systems, directly or indirectly?


by Luciom P

sure white life expectancy in the USA is the lowest of any white majority country (and the only one significantly decreasing post COVID) in the world even if the USA spends more than any country in the world in healthcare per person but there is no plight.

everything is fine as it is, china isn't pushing fentanyl in the USA and in the USA only even if the Biden admin explicitly says so, assassinating 60k+ working age American per year (mostl

Once we are done killing off the weakest of our breed, we will be more than fine.

Again, it is odd that you are worried about us. I am not. I can't quite put my finger on why a fellow white man could be worried about the plight of the white man.


by jjjou812 P

if I apply you test, what payments are you making into the American or Canadian systems, directly or indirectly?

my father is and my accounting (financial or otherwise) is family wide as I already expressed several times


by Luciom P

my father is and my accounting (financial or otherwise) is family wide as I already expressed several times

Lol. "My dad can pick up a tree"


Your dad should be mature enough to decide his gender affirming care without your input, whether you pay for it directly or indirectly (whatever the **** that means).


by jjjou812 P

It’s not my fault you can’t Google very well.

About 130,000,000 results (0.38 seconds)
Search Results
Featured snippet from the web
California law allows those under 21 to consume alcohol in a private location. Only if a parent, guardian, or relative is present and above the age of 21. It is illegal for a minor to have a BAC of . 01% and operate a vehicle.

California Alcohol Laws

I googled and cited a reputable source. You still haven't.


by jjjou812 P

I agree with you, my opinion doesn't matter either because I am not the patient or family member.

Name a medical procedure other than abortion, gender affirming care, birth control or cosmetic procedures that you and society feel you have a right to interject your beliefs into the decision making process.

All medical procedures.

They are all subject to law, which is made by representatives of the people, of whom I am one.


But I'm pretty sure you already knew that, as well as the fact that I'm not interjecting my beliefs any more than you are (we're both just participating in an online forum).

The only difference is that I can manage to do it without spewing insults and non sequitors.


by BrianTheMick2 P

Ummm. Acid rain was an actual problem that we (mostly) solved by reducing sulfur dioxide and nitrogen oxide emissions.

The satanic panic was an actual fake problem that we solved by ridiculing the right wing nutters who were freaking out.

One of the two is directly analogous.

It is actually pretty analogous.

You may recall that what started the satanic panic was adults acting on what unreliable children believed to be true, possibly due to the influence of adults asking leading questions.


by browser2920 P

I would guess you would also be against government subsidies to farmers, correct?

When you say that you want a say if you pay, isn't that what the elective representatives are for? Or do you believe somehow you should be consulted personally? Let's say you paid $20k in taxes. That doesn't actually by itself fund much of anything. So if you expect details, if they could say "well your 20k was used to buy 10% of a single $2 million cruise mis

Pretty poor logic here, especially from a moderator. Did you really think he meant that he should be able to decide government policy on his own? Or that he was just explaining his opinions on what said policies should be, the same as you are doing.


by chillrob P

All medical procedures.

They are all subject to law, which is made by representatives of the people, of whom I am one.


But I'm pretty sure you already knew that, as well as the fact that I'm not interjecting my beliefs any more than you are (we're both just participating in an online forum).

The only difference is that I can manage to do it without spewing insults and non sequitors.

Let's test those Google skills, cite me some laws that control medical procedures not on my list.

"All medical procedures" sounds like a cop out.


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