Israel/Palestine thread
Think this merits its own thread...
Discuss my fellow 2+2ers..
AM YISRAEL CHAI.
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The killementality is latent within us all.
I'd be interested to read the accounts of soldiers. Seems inconceivable to me, for having never lived it. Yet, it's ubiquitous now - 110 armed conflicts in the world at this time - and throughout history.
Micro, sup? Perpetual war has produced the science killemology.
Why?
Trump as president would not have been a blank check. There are limits to how much mass murder a Western nation can get away with.
Maybe because the Muslims chose the wrong enemy?
"The Muslims" have not chosen any enemies.
"The Muslims" at large are on on the side of Israel so its a dumb argument.
Sure, Muslims lives would be perfect with Jew around, why are we contesting this?
Maybe because the Muslims chose the wrong enemy? Maybe because they chose to target a population which deserves better treatment for a couple of centuries than all other human beings as reparations for what we (Muslim included) did to them?
Establishing a state where Jews will always be safe and protected after generations of harassment, discrimination, and mass death will not absolve Europe or the USA for letting the Holocaust happen.
Israel’s must exist, but it absolves no one.
They didn't attack gaza under trump because hamas didn't infiltrate Israel and kill rape abs take hostages under Trump so no idea why we are discussing
They didn't attack gaza under trump because hamas didn't infiltrate Israel and kill rape abs take hostages under Trump so no idea why we are discussing
still waiting on any evidence of rape and further any evidence that it was Hamas that did rape.
even charlatan Gettlemen walked it back after the NYT canceled its The Daily podcast with him bc he had been thoroughly debunked by anyone with google.
https://twitter.com/dawnmclancy/status/1...
its kinda funny that he doesnt want to use the word "evidence" when he used it a bunch of times in his bullshit article that is still used to justify genocide.
meanwhile, there is actually real evidence of sexual abuse from the Israelis.
https://news.un.org/en/story/2024/02/114...
ofc this is nothing new.
https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10....
from 2015 lol
and I am sure we have all forgotten this by now. but I didnt.
Israel are the real rapists and there is no excuse for supporting them unless...
Establishing a state where Jews will always be safe and protected after generations of harassment, discrimination, and mass death will not absolve Europe or the USA for letting the Holocaust happen.
Israel’s must exist, but it absolves no one.
Why is it so important for Europe and the US to absolve itself, but the Muslim nations get a free pass. Their history of harassment, discrimination and mass death (relative to absolute population levels being much smaller historically) is arguably just as bad, and continues pretty much unabated until this day.
What is the actual rationale reason for this difference, other than some unspoken belief that it is "the white man's burden" to be the moral compass for the entire world, and "brown" Muslims are incapable of moral agency.
Why is it so important for Europe and the US to absolve itself, but the Muslim nations get a free pass. Their history of harassment, discrimination and mass death (relative to absolute population levels being much smaller historically) is arguably just as bad, and continues pretty much unabated until this day.
What is the actual rationale reason for this difference, other than some unspoken belief that it is "the white man's burden" to be
again, its real hard for me to follow why the Gazans need to be wiped out just bc of Muslim nations treating Jews badly at certain points in time.
again, its real hard for me to follow why the Gazans need to be wiped out just bc of Muslim nations treating Jews badly at certain points in time.
Its a 1300 year straight run more or less. Pointing out there were certain periods when the Muslim were slightly less horrible than the Christians isn't exactly the glowing endorsement many of you seem to think it is.
And the religious motivated animosity is very much tied into why this war has been going on 80 years with little end in site, and cant just be hand waived away like you would like it to be.
I personally am not a big fan of using the distant past as motivation or justification for present actions. But I understand there are A LOT of people on this planet that do think this way, including many Zionists and hundreds of millions of Muslims; so discounting this reality doesn't seem like such a good idea.
this is not a religious war. the Gazans just want to end the occupation and stop being oppressed and murdered. its pretty simple really.
I personally am not a big fan of using the distant past as motivation or justification for present actions. But I understand there are A LOT of people on this planet that do think this way, including many Zionists and hundreds of millions of Muslims; so discounting this reality doesn't seem like such a good idea.
bruv, you use the distant past to justify war with the Muslims all the time in this thread. its like your whole thing.
still waiting on any evidence of rape and further any evidence that it was Hamas that did rape.
.
https://www.cbc.ca/news/world/hamas-sex-...
The open source photos and videos aren't enough?
https://www.phr.org.il/wp-content/upload...
https://www.timesofisrael.com/us-congres...
The US House of Representatives on Wednesday passed a bipartisan resolution condemning Hamas’s use of rape and sexual violence during and after its October 7 attack on Israel, alongside an event on Capitol Hill attended by several US lawmakers and senior Biden administration officials aimed at raising awareness of the terror group’s atrocities against civilians.
The bill passed 418-0, with only Palestinian-American lawmaker Rashida Tlaib voting “present.”
While the evidence and testimony of horrific sexual violence perpetrated by Hamas on October 7 have been widely documented, there have been no credible reports of sexual violence perpetrated by the IDF in Gaza.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2024/j...
In videos from 7 October, the body of a young woman is lying face down in the back of a pickup truck, stripped to her underwear, one leg bent at an unnatural angle. One of the men sitting next to her pulls her long hair as armed men around him shout praises to God.
Footage of the lifeless corpse of Shani Louk, a 22-year-old Israeli-German national, paraded around the streets of Gaza was some of the first to surface on 7 October, as the scale of the horror visited on sleeping families in kibbutzim neighbouring the strip and people partying at a nearby rave started to become clear.
Victor this is a bad look, even for you
Why is it so important for Europe and the US to absolve itself, but the Muslim nations get a free pass. Their history of harassment, discrimination and mass death (relative to absolute population levels being much smaller historically) is arguably just as bad, and continues pretty much unabated until this day.
What is the actual rationale reason for this difference, other than some unspoken belief that it is "the white man's burden" to be
You’re the one who claimed they are owed reparations from Europe et al.
Edit- Whoops, that was Luciom. Same difference eh
https://www.cbc.ca/news/world/hamas-sex-...
The open source photos and videos aren't enough?
right so no actual evidence. like I said.
The chaos meant there were significant failings in preserving evidence of gender-based violence and what is coming to be seen as the systematic use of rape as a weapon of war by Hamas.
I mean, its even in the article.
and Gettlemen himself (from the NYT article) even admitted that his article did not provide evidence.
the same person that claimed there was all this rape also claimed there were 40 beheaded babies and womens wombs cut open and all that crap.
you can believe what you want. you will believe anything that justifies the brutality from your team bc in your mind an Isreali can never do anything wrong.
but some of us still believe in truth regardless of religion and ethnicity.
Does ending the occupation tomorrow maintain a reasonable degree of safety for Israel? I generally don't know the answer.
no one knows the answer for sure. Hamas offered a 10 year cease fire for an end to the occupation in 2005 or thereabouts. they are much less hard line now as they have governed for years and are beholden to the population. also they ended suicide bombing like a decade ago. and they have offered an end to rocket attacks many times and abided by their end of that bargain until things heated up again for various reasons.
the most recent cease fire offer from Hamas was quite simply asking for human rights. they wanted a full hostage exchange, withdrawal of Israeli forces to a buffer zone, allowing humanitarian aid and food to Gaza, and allowing civilians to return to their homes as most of them are displaced in the south right now.
this was ofc called over the top by Biden and this very thread was heavily critical of it. its seems to me that most of this thread does not want the civilians of Gaza to live like human beings and does not care if they live or die (or even leans towards wanting more of them to die bc I mean, thats the result of no food and an army committing war crimes daily. its death for many.)
so right now, Hamas is not even asking for an end to the occupation. they just want to save the lifes of the civilian population. really to save the society bc Israel is targeting the pillars of society and the people who make it work, in particular health care workers, journalists, bakers, professors, organizers, intellectuals.
and ofc they are targetting the family members of Hamas leaders and fighters. this was referenced when Hamas presented the cease fire offer. they straight up said, we want this to end bc our family members are being killed. I ofc remember how much the liberals in the West and America got all huffy when Trump said that he would kill the family members of America's enemies. now the liberals are like, whelp thats fine.
from an objective standpoint there is one side that wants perpetual war. its the side that has been stealing land and doing murder for decades. its the side that has the war power on their side.
if the circumstances were flipped and the Gazans got some sort of super weapons that gave them the upper hand would they treat the Israeli's as they have been treated? maybe. but to use that as the reason to exterminate a population is disgusting and will go down in history as one of the greatest acts of immoral brutality of this era.
I have no doubt that this will go down in history as similar to the holocaust and the Armenian genocide.
The statements by Lula the other day have caused a big uproar and Israel is demanding that he take it back.
I see Victor quoted that he still needs evidence of rape yet his defenders say he acknowledged the rape
Good stuff as always
Us vetoing the ceasefire resolution is a present surprise
Biden has gotten a little tougher on Israel at times, but even he realizes that a ceasefire without hostage release cannot happen
The fact that the vote is 13-1-1 (lol UK abstention) shows what a ****ing joke the UN is
Passive aggression is a sign of emotional immaturity, Mets. If you want to address people’s posts, do it in the first person like an adult.
