Israel/Palestine thread
Think this merits its own thread...
Discuss my fellow 2+2ers..
AM YISRAEL CHAI.
[QUOTE=Crossnerd]Edit: RULES FOR THIS THREAD
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Please be aware this thread is strictly moderated[/quote]
Ilan Pappe predited that this culture
would lead to this
Well I'm gonna step in it, but the Haredim are DEFINITELY using their birthrates to change Israel. Both in their words (very publicly) and in results.
The next Israeli election is going to take place almost entirely around this issue.
Israel needs soldiers, they are comfortably 30k short, but it's probably more. And today every Jewish group but the Haredim serve. The issue is that since Oct 7th, Israelis can finally see a world in which Israel doesn't exist, and it's terrifying to them. The notion that the largest growing segment (over 2:1) neither want to serve, nor pay their tax share, AND have the most extreme views on the fate of Palestinians, is both scary and very ass backwards. So it looks like this will be the great issue that create new coalitions.
Now on the other side of this, I'll post from Al Jazeera
https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2014/11/2...
It's a lovely video interview from 2014, where they explain how crucial large families are to fighting Israel. Husein's words are poignant. Between the deaths and jailings, they feel an obligation to have large families. And if you ask me, that's both noble and beautiful. I have a lot of admiration for the beauty in that level of commitment. I also don't believe it's representative of all of them. But there's no Israeli black magic here, this is what is being reported from neutral sources.
I suppose I'll take my multi week ban now. But I've presented you two segments of this region with very intentional views on why big families are important. And if I've broken some sort of site rule, I guess I'll do the time now.
Israel needs soldiers, they are comfortably 30k short, but it's probably more. And today every Jewish group but the Haredim serve. The issue is that since Oct 7th, Israelis can finally see a world in which Israel doesn't exist, and it's terrifying to them. The notion that the largest growing segment (over 2:1) neither want to serve, nor pay their tax share, AND have the most extreme views on the fate of Palestinians, is both scary and very
This does indeed seem to be a problem. Importing large numbers of high-birthrate settlers, of frankly peculiar ideology, who do not recognise the legitimacy of the state on whose protection they rely and whose franchise they seek to exploit, against the common good, was probably never a sound notion.
I dont think China's veto is of any importance other than empty verbatim with a rival. China is still heavily invested in Israel.
This does indeed seem to be a problem. Importing large numbers of high-birthrate settlers, of frankly peculiar ideology, who do not recognise the legitimacy of the state on whose protection they rely and whose franchise they seek to exploit, against the common good, was probably never a sound notion.
They weren't imported, they were rescued and safeguarded. Leaving the camps they had nothing and nowhere to go.
That particular community suffered some of the worst destruction in the holocaust. The destruction to the Jewish scholarly community (whatever you think of it) was almost an extinction level event. So when they were granted safety in the land of Israel, they took it upon themselves to target these birthrates to replenish what was lost in the Shoah (in terms of religious knowledge and expertise developed over thousands of years). This is a matter of historical record.
None of this was done intentionally (the political outcomes), there's no grand plan. The Shoah annihilated the global Jewish community, and Israel created a place to help bring that back from the brink. But you can't police that, specially not after THAT. You save and house whom you can.
That this plays out to eventually become a national majority is just what happens with enough time. And now we're in a place where something needs to happen fairly urgently, while there's time. One of those "somethings" is making military service look less horrible at the community level. Don't know if you guys know this, but if someone in the Haredim serve, their value on the marriage market plummets near zero. Their whole family is shamed. So THAT is what Israel hopes to change. The world view of what service to your country means. And we're even talking support roles. Nobody thinks for a second to place them in combat.
calling the govt of palestine a terrorist group is some racist **** in its own right.
Hamas only ever governed Gaza, for certain values of the word 'government' (it is a deadly enemy of Fatah, the Palestinian Authority in the West Bank) and is considered a terrorist organisation by all NATO countries, the EU, Australia, New Zealand and Japan. Though not of course by Russia, China and North Korea, or percentage players like Brazil and India.
One of those "somethings" is making military service look less horrible at the community level. Don't know if you guys know this, but if someone in the Haredim serve, their value on the marriage market plummets near zero. Their whole family is shamed. So THAT is what Israel hopes to change. The world view of what service to your country means. And we're even talking support roles. Nobody thinks for a second to place them in combat.
Why???
That particularly community believes entirely in devotion to religious studies and observance. The second you're spending time doing anything else, you're an outcast. So the same would be true if one of them decided to start a daily podcast on soccer. You just don't.
I think many religions have their versions of the Haredim. People just frozen in time.
They weren't imported, they were rescued and safeguarded. Leaving the camps they had nothing and nowhere to go.
No, very few Haredi emerged from the camps and they have since been imported from elsewhere, notably the US, and have also gained by conversion due to post-1967 religious triumphalism.
I am grateful that the extremely remedial sitewide rules against hateful and dehumanizing speech are belatedly being enforced, yes.
Careful with your wishes as the way you and others talk about rightwing western voters could be framed as hateful and dehumanizing very easily as well
Btw I missed the understanding that Browser was in some sort of a medical situation, and likely unable to attend to all this. I don't want to appear to be taking advantage of his absence. Also wish him the best possible outcomes there.
I'm gonna self ban here, you won't see me online. I'll go chill with my brother Mets. Factor that into eventual sentencing, or not.
Have a great weekend my dudes, and good Shabbas.
yhtsi
Israel says it’s going into Rafah and doesn’t care if US turns her back on Israel
rafiki, take care and keep something handy
what camps? what evacuation? what world do you live in?
Btw I missed the understanding that Browser was in some sort of a medical situation, and likely unable to attend to all this. I don't want to appear to be taking advantage of his absence. Also wish him the best possible outcomes there.
I'm gonna self ban here, you won't see me online. I'll go chill with my brother Mets. Factor that into eventual sentencing, or not.
Have a great weekend my dudes, and good Shabbas.
Not me this time, but for you
