Israel/Palestine thread
Think this merits its own thread...
Discuss my fellow 2+2ers..
AM YISRAEL CHAI.
[QUOTE=Crossnerd]Edit: RULES FOR THIS THREAD
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This could have been done without lying about the origin of "cope cages" which is not even relevant to the discussion. See the link I gave you which goes into the actual origin of the meme, instead of when it began to piss you off.
as for a discussion about Israelis being radicalized, well that was your attempt to justify the murder and amputation of an entire society.
False. It doesn't even make sense.
your entire last sentence is false ofc bc well Israel. Russia has never had an imperial conquest even close to what we are seeing right now. you should stop downplaying it. maybe you will have children one day and they will see how much you love supporting genocide. or maybe this website is gone by then. if I were you, I would hope it is bc your genocidal posting and support of the most murderous people is disgusting and shameful.
Disgusting. False. Shameful. Projection.
Haven't been here for a minute but both sides can agree this is just for show right ?
Iran had to save face for getting hit on their own soil. if they really wanted war this minute they wouldn't be giving notice and sending basically fireworks
No. Israel got what it wanted. An attack from Iran.
Now that that critical domino has fallen or something.
i woke up today nervous, as the last thing i'd seen before going to bed was reports of cruise missiles being fired from iran. it was a relief to wake up and see that iran's attack was flaccid
its days like this where you are reminded of things you take for granted. iran's leaders have not been cowed by a few hundred thousand jewish teenagers running around the desert with uzis, they have instead been cowed by the greatest nation in the history of civilization, the United States of America
without the steadfast and heroic actions of the USA now and over the preceding decades, a second holocaust would've been achieved. it is because of the USA that the civilians of israel can sleep soundly at night, knowing that the hundreds of millions of neighbors who consider it their godly duty to rid the middle east of jews will NEVER achieve their goal
American friends, i salute every one of you today, and offer my sincere thanks
I listened to a podcast that said Palestinians are more ethnically Jewish than the European and American Jews that came in 1947
True?
Rabbi Boids, you are welcome.
How can you call USA greatest nation in history without knowing all other nations histories
I think he is being a bit disingenuous (or diplomatic)
The concern is they will respond because they have thought through the consequences.
A bit of both imo. I think there's two aspects here. One is that Israel was planning to provoke a response from Iran and then retaliate against that response. That was clearly thought out ahead of time and despite the underwhelming (thankfully) attack by Iran they might still go through with it.
The other aspect is that Bibi is extremely arrogant. This is from 2010, but still a good read:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/...
Netanyahu: ‘America is a thing you can move very easily’
The quote from the US officials, and Biden, could also be a warning for the second aspect: that Bibi does not move USA as easily as he thinks, what he's doing here is pretty transparent, and he does not know the consequences of what he's planning as well as he thinks he does in regard to how his current allies with respond.
Haven't been here for a minute but both sides can agree this is just for show right ?
Iran had to save face for getting hit on their own soil. if they really wanted war this minute they wouldn't be giving notice and sending basically fireworks
Iran doesn't want a full scale war but this is the first time ever they attacked Israel directly from their soil if what I read is correct.
The attack has some justification but bear in mind the embassy attack wasn't officially by Israel
i woke up today nervous, as the last thing i'd seen before going to bed was reports of cruise missiles being fired from iran. it was a relief to wake up and see that iran's attack was flaccid
its days like this where you are reminded of things you take for granted. iran's leaders have not been cowed by a few hundred thousand jewish teenagers running around the desert with uzis, they have instead been cowed by the greatest nation in the histo
How far is Iran from developing atomic bombs?
A bit of both imo. I think there's two aspects here. One is that Israel was planning to provoke a response from Iran and then retaliate against that response. That was clearly thought out ahead of time and despite the underwhelming (thankfully) attack by Iran they might still go through with it.
The other aspect is that Bibi is extremely arrogant. This is from 2010, but still a good read:
I dont disagree with you. I just dont think any of that is covered by not thinbking it through - netanyahu might miscalculate the odds but I dont think there's any chance that it isn't being throught through. There's also timing. Netanyahu may delay response knowing he can do it later or even prod iran again. Netanyahu personal interest seem so strongly tied to escalation
It's also such a dangerous dance being played out with so many moving parts. A few terrorist taking out an USA target (even against Iran's wishes) could be a big enough spark. Maybe they can find an archduke to shoot.
Vic must be beside himself with rage at the tepid outcome of the Iranian attack.
Why would I care? I just hope Israel doesn't go all Hitler on the rest of the ME. Something you guys are certainly engorged thinking about.
Meanwhile it's now the 3rd straight day of terrorist pogroms in the West Bank. (BGP still hasn't condemned them btw).
More reports of murder from air drops via drowning or impact.
And Israel fired on a bunch of women and children returning to their homes. Or really "homes" bc it's all just rubble.
Thats the stuff that makes me rage corpus. Unfortunately I am not like you and BOIDs who revel in genociding oppressed people.
i woke up today nervous, as the last thing i'd seen before going to bed was reports of cruise missiles being fired from iran. it was a relief to wake up and see that iran's attack was flaccid
its days like this where you are reminded of things you take for granted. iran's leaders have not been cowed by a few hundred thousand jewish teenagers running around the desert with uzis, they have instead been cowed by the greatest nation in the histo
Dont forget us plucky brits
A little earlier, we heard from Rishi Sunak, who confirmed UK planes intercepted weapons launched by Iran towards Israel.
Here’s everything else that Sunak said:
The UK participated in an “international coordinated effort”
The RAF sent additional planes to the region as part of existing operations to “counter Daesh in Iraq and Syria”
RAF planes shot down “a number of Iranian attack drones”
Haven't been here for a minute but both sides can agree this is just for show right ?
Iran had to save face for getting hit on their own soil. if they really wanted war this minute they wouldn't be giving notice and sending basically fireworks
Myrna, if "hit on your own soil" was reason enough to attack someone, Southern Lebanon and Gaza would have been flattened a while back. This is the thing people don't realize about Israel because they've never lived there. You get 12-14 seconds to run to your bomb shelter in Israel, and you do it many times per week with your toddler depending on your address. Imagine the USA tolerating that with kids in say Texas? Just never happen. They'd already be at war.
My take is Israel will retaliate "alone" very soon. Because these fights are coming ANYWAY. You can have them now on your terms or you can wait. But Israel has these fights coming with 100% certainty no matter what. Today, in 5 years, it's already decided.
October 7th reminded Israelis that they took their safety for granted. Last night only reinforced that. The 3 main threats to Israeli safety are Iran, Hezbollah, and Hamas in that order of importance.
Right now, the North of Israel is evacuated. Something fairly unprecedented (imagine just evacuating upstate New York for 6 months). That means war with Hezbollah (which is coming no matter what anyway) is timed better now. Do it while your civilians aren't there and your army is as sharp as it gets. The nuclear Iran issue had been issue #1 in Israel till this operation in Gaza. Suddenly they're being gifted an opportunity to set it back significantly and buy more time. The most recent assessments had Iran able to arm a warhead in maybe as little as 2-3 years. So right now they get a spot to go put a significant amount of the program into distress, and receive a reasonable amount of political cover in doing so. I bolded "alone" because we'll find out if the Americans let them refuel on their carriers, OR if the Saudis let them land on their airfields. If the Saudis let them refuel, that's a big deal. The Jordanians yesterday was already a big deal.
Once Israel attacks the Iranian nuclear program (which the Saudies want too btw), Hezbollah will attack from the north. Then Israel will invade Southern Lebanon for the purpose of eliminating Hezbollah. So in the span of 12 months Israel could take it to their 3 biggest existential threats we listed earlier.
There were moments like this for Ukraine before Russia attacked btw. In hindsight now, Ukraine would have done it very differently. Sometimes if the fight is coming to you anyway, it's better to be on the offensive. Let's hope the whole thing is reasonably contained.
1. Even if true he’d deny it.
2. He’s more likely to just not give a **** about what the Iranians do. His M.O. is hatred toward those in power and not give a **** about anyone else. Iran, in his conception of the world, is not in power, and is therefore irrelevant and only a passive participant with no agency.
Israel will attack Lebanon yes, using the attacks from Lebanon that were parts of the coordinated effort with Iran.
I fear Israel is a bit stretched militarily though to both conduct a proper war in Lebanon and eradicate Hamas from Rafah.
So maybe this would mean they will delay entering Rafah yet another time?
Victor seemed to me to be clearly hoping Iran wouldn't respond
Meanwhile it's now the 3rd straight day of terrorist pogroms in the West Bank. (BGP still hasn't condemned them btw).
What are you blabbering on about? I've already said the West Bank is nuts, what they're doing is indefensible and I agree with the sanctions against those people.
Think of all the things you haven't condemned. Just constant nonsense...
Bibi going to war with Iran itself is political suicide.
Iran can and will do damage to Israeli proper.
For Israel as a nation, such a war would be absolutely disastrous as well.
Jordanians and Saudis will also be far less interested in helping Israel in an offensive operation than in a defensive one.
Biden already said the US will not participate in an offensive operation against Iran (his awful foreign policy instincts are in play again)
Israel just cannot afford to signal that it will never back down even when Iran is practically begging to get out of this with some face.
