The costs of trans visibility

thank you, this is why i appreciate you

I'd have thought that if you saw your buddy making insane accusations like "you support rape" that maybe THAT would be the spot where you would jump into the conversation to pick out that one side isn't being perfectly fair and accurate. Instead we get the ridiculous nitpick you are digging in on. But let's go to the original statement.

Does any part of that imply rick remembered that trans people can put that they are trans in their profile? He calls this the "more than anything" issue - one that can improve 10 fold - is to stop this time wasting. But surely any trans person worried by this can at minimum dramatically reduce this issue of waiting until chatting by putting it in their profile. You've come up with this nitpick response that but but but but but but but but MAYBE some people will not see it in their profile and so it still wastes a bit of time here and there. The system actually seems really well designed to give trans people the choice of whether they want to display it or not. I think the reality is nobody really believes that the chief concern - for trans people - is anything to do with this. It might be a concern for you and rick, that you guys might have to chat with a trans person who doesn't immediately reveal they are trans, but that isn't what was quoted.

My only concern was in refuting incorrect claims about the app. That's where I came in to the discussion, and that's all I have commented on.

uke, you're being intentionally obtuse, you're not nearly this stupid

Ironically, correcting Rick’s inaccurate claims about the app was indeed my original purpose too. His big issue is almost entirely mooted by an app setting. Unfortunately he decided to conclude from this that I supported rape.

you're just intentionally lying now, can you be any more of a scumbag?

Are you saying you did not say I supported rape? Receipts just up thread!

You can’t possibly accuse anyone else of being a scumbag when you say things like that.

This is the sort of exchange that speeds up people like me (lefty libby types) seeing through this stuff.

First poll I found said 3% of straight men and 1% of straight women would date trans. So the filter would be helpful.

It's obviously not the end of the world to chat with a trans person... or a gay guy or a straight guy or a lesbian. But they keep pretending that this is the issue, knowing it isn't.

The issue is not that it's a horror to chat w/ a trans person, it's that having a filter 97-99% of people would use just seems like common sense. If you aren't matched with lesbians or straight men, why would you be matched with trans women?

The fact that most trans people flag themselves as such is probably evidence they want to speed up the filtration too.

Now maybe bumble has their reasons. Like, I can see why they don't have race filters, though some would use them. But this exhausting Abbott and Costello routine where they pretend to not understand simple stuff....

Seen the same format with, "why aren't you attracted to transwomen if you are straight?"

Because I'm into women.

But trans women ARE women.

Yeah sure... ok I don't like penis.

But women can have penises...

Look, I like curvy people who can have babies.

Actually that means your bi...

See also actually having to debate if being seven inches taller and 3x stronger is an advantage in basketball.

At a certain point you realize truth, as it's understood in most contexts, is not the issue. This is true of certain political perspectives both left and right.

Like, you can show a Christian Identitarian evidence that sex Ed reduces abortion till you're blue in the face. It doesn't matter cuz that's not how they think.

If you have some sort of enlightenment/rationalist/science/logic based view of truth, this is kinda disquieting.

again, you mention two things, one of which was an outright lie and the other wasn't

you magically only bring up the one that isn't a lie

this just pure shitbag douchehole posting and why you just suck as a person

rob and I were very patient and politely pointing out your mistake with the app and showing evidence why, you still insist that your imagination of how it works is correct

and again you love playing the victim or ignore that and try to redirect it to an obviously tongue in cheek joke that you support rape - which i don't deny nor ever did deny saying

you know all of this, unlike some posters here who are too stupid to even debate with and thus on ignore, you are not this phenomenally stupid as you're pretending right now

however, i do stand by that failing to disclose that you have a penis to a prospective dating partner is absolutely wrong

i showed you the clip from revenge of the nerds, which everyone agrees is rape, she into it, she enjoyed it, she even initiated it, but was misled into thinking something else was going on, which is the sole reason it happened in the first place

if there is a scenario where a trans person waits until the absolutely last minute to disclose they are trans ie right before the pants come off then it's reasonable to believe that some making out, heavy petting, perhaps even a blowjob may have occurred prior to that - which would all be sexual assault due to there not being consent

we even have documented cases of trans people where trans have gone so far as to use a bit of smoke and mirrors (and probably some alcohol and drugs i would guess) to even engage in sex without revealing they are trans

and this is not good for anyone, while I'm not excusing the extreme response some have taken, there would without a doubt be fewer murders of trans people if this never happened as there are many documented cases of this and also why so many of the murder victims are sex workers

it's not just a stupid feature, it literally normalizes sexual assault and promotes the kind of awful situations which are fundamental reason why trans are murdered at such high rates

Doubly ironic, you somehow still think that you were right.

i think it's an act, there's no way he's that level of stupid, like pile of rocks stupid - i think he's just trolling to bait me to cross a line to catch a ban at this point

Ya know, I've never used this app before. But at the beginning rick said this:
[QUOTE=rick, being wrong]more than anything, i think the trans dating experience would improve 10 fold if people like me could filter them out so they don't waste time on that and regularly get unmatched by men when they finally disclose it while chatting[/QUOTE]And it just didn't pass the smell test. Surely "finally disclose it while chatting" can't be the only way trans people let everyone know they are trans, right? Because IF that was true, I would agree that a 10 fold improvement could be made by having trans people be able to disclose this before chatting. But in under a minute I discovered that there IS precisely this feature. You can argue around the margins maybe some people don't notice that their profiles say they are trans, but the idea that THIS is the "more than anything" problem with a potential 10 fold improvement to be made? GTFO.

this is your fundamental problem, you have utterly zero faith that anyone else could be honest that you would rather suppose that you understand something you've never experienced by how you imagine it should work than rather how people who are in the trenches tell you it actually works

i take back everything i said about you being intelligent, that's simply impossible, you're an utter imbecilic ideologue

Have to say, we haven't seen the "look at these hypothetical bad trans people" vibes this strong since Cuepee left.

Ick. This victim blaming murders of trans people on said hypothetical bad trans people is particularly gross.

Hard to know what to do with this level of insanity. I don't know which is more ridiculous, your pet theory for why trans people are murdered (hint: it is the fault of bad trans people) or the preposterous idea that an app setting normalizes sexual assault. WTF.

Well at least I think we've found the real reason you got so up in arms about the app setting issue!

Lol, decided dropping the R word would get you banned and so ninja edited in a new insult?

The simple fact is that trans people do NOT have to finally disclose it when chatting", they can disclose it right on the profile. Pretty simple and well designed really. I have no idea why that upset you so much you had to sink to this level, but you do you.

uke are you now actually denying that a large chunk of trans people who are murdered for being trans happened after they failed to disclose their status to their sexual partners?

I really - really - didn't have victim blaming trans people for getting murdered on my bingo sheet for tonight. But then I didn't have "you support rape" or "sham marriage" either, so I should stop being surprised.

But sure, show me whatever stats you have. I'll take a look.

You'll probably not believe this either, but so few people use that self identification that I've never noticed it in at least 7 years of using the app semi-regularly. Likely the same thing with rick, so that perfect solution you think is there isn't any kind of solution at all and his initial post was completely right.

I just took a look at the app again right now, and the only thing it shows on the main profile page is the picture, name, and age. You have to scroll down to read anything more about the person, which I do about 1% of the time, and that's likely the same for almost all men who use the site.

But sure, go ahead and think you're the expert about how well the site works for everyone.

You realize that the only reason it got to this point is because you have been so stubborn in your ignorance.

Just curious, do you believe that you have never been wrong about any subject you know nothing about? Have you ever admitted you were wrong about anything?

uke, it's considered rape

calling that victim blaming is just insane

that would be fair if it were someone getting killed for being trans, or killed by a lover who knew they they were trans then sure - if i went and said "well they shouldn't have been trying to date" or "they shouldn't have gone out in public" then that's a case of hateful victim blaming

stating a simple fact that a huge chunk of trans who are murdered are murdered for deceiving sexual partners and fewer would be murdered if none did that is not hateful nor bigoted - it's a simple fact - only an ideologue such as yourself would ever label that victim blaming

but someone who intentionally deceives people in order to seek or sell sex does carry some blame there - obviously those people were not right to do that and in your sick twisted mind you're already setting that up that i defend the murders of trans

but frankly, over 1/3 of those on this list were killed after a prospective or active sexual partner discovered they were trans - these people would have never been murdered if beforehand they disclosed that fact

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_pe...

Not surprising at all. Trans women in general are rare. I'd imagine of the trans woman going on online dating apps, that apps targeting straight people are probably not their go to. I'd imagine many of those that want to use bumble would use the "non-binary" option (and then trans woman or whatever suboption) which DOES allow you to filter against non-binary people. Of those that want to be in women's section, some will disclose on their profile, some won't. And as you say, you don't even look at profiles, so seems unlikely you would notice something you don't look at. Maybe every one of those assumptions isn't flawless, but collectively I'm not surprised you don't frequently see it.

I do have two genuine questions - do you look at profiles when after matching and when you might start chatting? And secondly, are you regularly matching with trans people and only finding out about it when chatting (or later!)

You are literally blaming these murder victims. Calling it victim blaming is just applying the definition.

It's sick.

I usually don't look at their full profile until the person has sent me a message because on Bumble the woman has to send the first message.

So even if the man reads the profile before replying, the trans woman has already had to stick herself out there and risk rejection by starting the chat.

I don't know if I've answered your first question or not. It looks like there's a missing out extra word so I don't understand the question.

For the second question, I wouldn't say that I regularly match with trans women, but it certainly has happened many times before. And because of the way the system works I do not find out until the chat has technically begun.

no, you're just a coward who was proven wrong and are now shifting goal posts to an emotional argument because facts failed you

you can't possibly admit you're wrong, so instead you turn it into personal attacks