Israel/Palestine thread
Think this merits its own thread...
Discuss my fellow 2+2ers..
AM YISRAEL CHAI.
[QUOTE=Crossnerd]Edit: RULES FOR THIS THREAD
Posting guidelines for Politics and Soci...
These are our baselines. We're not reinventing the wheel here. If you aren't sure if something is acceptable to post, its better to ask first. If you think someone is posting something that violates the above guidelines, please report it or PM me rather than responding in kind.
To reiterate some of the points:
1. No personal attacks. This is a broad instruction, but, in general, we want to focus on attacking an argument rather than the poster making it. It is fine to say a post is antisemitic; it is not okay to call someone an antisemite over and over. If you believe someone is making antisemitic posts, report them or PM me. The same goes for calling people "baby killers" and "genocide lovers". You are allowed to argue that an action supports genocide or that the consequences of certain policies results in the death of children, but we are no longer going to be speaking to one another's intentions. It is not productive to the conversation and doesn't further any debate.
2. Racist posts and other bigoted statements that target a particular group or individuals of such groups with derogatory comments are not allowed. This should not need further explanation.
3. Graphic Images need to be in spoilers with a trigger warning.
4. Wishing Harm on other posters will result in an immediate timeout.
5. Genocidal statements such as "Kill 'em all" etc, are no longer permissible in the thread.
If anyone has any questions about the above, please PM me. I don't want a discussion about the rules to derail the content of this thread. If anything needs clarifying, I will do that in this thread.
Please be aware this thread is strictly moderated[/quote]
There actually is a tangible difference in ideology if Hamas coordinated rape attacks as part of their military strategy vs Hamas simply consisting of men, a % of whom rape.
There is a difference in ideology also if the % of rapists among Hamas 10 7 attackers is a lot higher than the % of rapists among Americans in, say, Afghanistan
I have posted this before but I will post it again for referece.
As a reminder, the US military raped their way through Okinawa. It wasn't a coordinated plan. But it happened.
Just to understand, why should we use as reference the opinion of an actual communist on any topic?
And I was told I have an obsession with Marxism, Marxism doesn't exist anymore, doesn't influence people anymore...
Here we have a mod who is actually basing her interpretation of how to mod on a topic on the opinion of a communist on the topic
It isn't an excuse. Its an indictment. If men were so horrified by rape, they would stop each other from raping. Instead, its a hallmark of male violence that permeates the entirety of human history.
Is your claim is that men treat rape today in the same way they did when it was accepted if it was the rape of foreigners, in the past? and that based on the reference of a communist writer?
You can have that opinion but it goes against all empirical evidence of women’s history of sexual violence in war time. Indeed, it is a phenomenon that has not diminished within the framework of other atrocities within modern history. You can be mad at me for citing it, or mad at the men who make it true. The patriarchy is a monolith, but if you want to “not all men” me, by all means, I am versed in that arena.
proof needed for western armies. I need proof for the claim "all men equally". That the propensity to rape is higher in men than in women is biologically obvious. Proof needed that all culture in all of history managed that propensity identically. Otherwise we can *rank cultures for their propensity to allow rape* in a moral sense, which would put western culture above basically all others, in that regard.
A lot of proof needed to deny that.
"the patriarchy is a monolith" what?
Anyway at the university of Turin, currently occupied by students (at least some building), an imam described how the jihad is the greatest moral effort, to which women and children participate as well, for liberation of their lands
https://x.com/MarcoFattorini/status/1793...
Source unfortunately in italian (the imam is speaking in italian)
One thing i never properly understood is why the WB isn't Jordan territory, and Gaza egypt territory
I thought it was basically because they didn't want back after Israel ended their active occupation. I have seen others state as much here at least about Gaza. They don't seem to care about the people who live there any more than Israel does.
must... not... internet argue... with people justifying bombing kids, hospitals, and apartment buildings
It's been at least a few days since anyone as mentioned hospitals and apartment building here. Very little talk of kids either. And I haven't seen anyone claim that anything in particular was just. Maybe you're just talking about the people on reddit who Victor often criticizer for...reasons?
Dunyain, first of all, I can find no credible online reference for the bolded. Second of all, this above post is riddled with Islamophobic rhetoric far past what is acceptable. Please take a timeout from this thread until 12:00 AM Eastern Time. Please be warned any further posting that violates the bigotry and racism rule for this thread will result in temp bans. Please do not disregard this message. Thank you, friend.
Wow. I honestly have no idea what you would find to be bigoted rhetoric in Dunyain's post.
Nope. It’s on the person pulling the trigger, always. You don’t see cops leveling city blocks because murderers live there.
To be fair, you do see that every once in a while.
No, quite, massive regional nuclear superpower, invincible by any reasonable measure, and yet they still make the 'Poor little us' claim all the time.
Whenever my 7 pound toothless morkie decides to be stupid aggressive towards a giant scary looking dog, the big dog always gets a sad look on its face and I do feel bad for it.
Could point to decades of killing on either side and say the same. Surely, Hamas 2.0 will find the same justification in the future from what’s happening now. Every event needs to be evaluated for itself. Thinking you can forever avoid moral culpability because of some injury in the past is nonsense. It’s literally not different than Hamas.
Some here seem to think that poor black people in the US should be able do this.
I wasn't asking you.
I don't know how else to explain to you that there isn't a minimum body count. Again, you can easily look up the UN's working definition of terms like genocide and ethnic cleansing for yourself.
I see the phrase "intent to destroy" there. It doesn't seem to me that Israel is trying to destroy the Palestinian Arab people.
Same day as the footage of the five 19 year old girls in their pjs being taken, all live on gopro. Yes, enlisted IDF women unarmed and off duty. But the footage is a tough watch.
It's been a pretty brutal reminder of what the IDF is fighting for.
But they did perform the social nicety of telling the girls how pretty they all are.
Wherever men wage war, they rape. This is an undisputed historical fact of women's history. The question is not whether rape and sexual violence occured- The question is whether rape and sexual violence was a coordinated and planned aspect of the attack. I do not doubt rape occurred. I know it did. Women know it did.
How sure are you about this? And does your definition of rape include all sex with 9yo girls?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aisha
With regard to your posts about rape happening in every war, since ever - sadly, rape is a successful reproductive strategy which is selected by evolution. And soldiers are not known for restraining their baser instincts. In fact, they seem to mostly be trained to embrace them.
You're in denial.
You know rape happened.
Hamas knows rape happened. Hamas kept allowing it to happen to those under their captivity. Hamas has come out and said given the chance they'll do 10/7 again, and at a larger scale.
There is no world where you can reasonably think Hamas isn't intentionally using rape as a weapon.
Don't fall for the trap of believing Hamas, and other Islamic extremists, represent "devout Muslims." If they really do, y
It seems to me that she got that part correct. But there are definitely a good number of less devout and more peaceful Muslims in other parts of the world. I hear that's true about Indonesia anyway.
It isn't an excuse. Its an indictment. If men were so horrified by rape, they would stop each other from raping. Instead, its a hallmark of male violence that permeates the entirety of human history.
This seems like a very bigoted misandrist statememt to me. I am certainly horrified by rape, and I would stop other men from raping if I could. Unfortunately I am no more able to do that than are the women of the world.
#notallmen
I am off for the night. But I will leave you with a question:
If 2 IDF soldiers grabbed an 18 year old Palestinian girl and raped her with glee in front of a family member, would anyone be asking if it was "coordinated"?
Night y'all.
Don't think this is much of a hypothetical. I'd think it's extremely probable this has happened during the last 40+ years and I don't think there are many people that would propose it was orders from above. It's an unfortunate byproduct of war that probably all countries are guilty of.
