Israel/Palestine thread
Think this merits its own thread...
Discuss my fellow 2+2ers..
AM YISRAEL CHAI.
[QUOTE=Crossnerd]Edit: RULES FOR THIS THREAD
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The Patten report didn’t say: that sexual violence was beyond reasonable doubt, systematic, widespread and ordered and perpetrated by Hamas.
Israeli advocates for the female survivors are now warning that the country’s refusal to co-operate with a full and legal investigation, which the carefully worded report was not, threatens the prospect of ever finding out the full truth about the sexual violence of October 7 and delivering justice for its victims.
Decent people don’t distinguish between “mass rape” and “rape.” It’s clear as day that Hamas committed rape of innocent women that day.
Only people like you fight about the “category” of rape. I wonder why that is.
Only "people like me" want to be sure of the facts before we accuse people of mass rape (though individual rapes happen in most wars, as BOIDS himself observed). Of course, all are disgusting acts and among the worst atrocities of war.
You want to condemn people on the grounds of Israeli government accusations which they refuse to officially investigate. Now I wonder why that is.
If your concern is for the victims of rape you should be focussing your efforts on condemning the Israeli government for not investigating, instead of smearing people on the internet.
another one who wants independent investigators to granted access to the vaginas of israeli rape victims before he is prepared to believe them. keep your independent probes to yourself
i assume you feel silly for telling us that the times concluded that mass rapes did not occur now that you have read the article. as you are now aware, the article is in fact a piece on various oct 7 rape deniers and their theories, and delivers no conclusion on the matter
the fact that there are people who reject the vast majority of mainstream reporting on the matter and instead favour their own rape denial theories is not news to anyone that has read this thread and specifically your posts in it
I am watching the 3 Body Problem right now, which takes place in part during the Chinese Cultural Revolution. And the show runners made a point to show the revolution as accurate as possible. You really can replace the word "Imperialist" with "Zionist" and the similarities between the the rhetoric of the far left today and the revolutionists in 1966 are striking.
What point are you attempting to make regarding rape on October 7?
Did it occur?
Was it planned?
Was it discouraged?
You can't just make it up. Hostage taking may be a strong stategy but it's strong in part because responding in way that kills the hostages is such a weak response.
Do those who think responding in a way that kills the hostages is the correct thing to do feel the same when it's the hostages from their own side?
For the left. Leftist ideology is in fact what enables hostage taking, that's the point.
The lack of ability to accept deaths today can be the better outcome is the problem.
The inane obsession with saving every life at every cost (that we have seen with COVID as well) very often actually causes more deaths and suffering.
Leftism is, as usual, much more the actual cause of the problems it purportedly wants to fix, than the solution.
Yes I feel the same for Italian hostages.
And btw in general when you have enemies you have to be willing to lose domestic blood to beat them, or they already won right? That part I think you get intuitively.
Why would hostages be any different, I don't understand.
As I said, I think the Israeli extraction team met way more resistance than they were expecting, and the extraction did go sideways.
And the fact Palestinian "civilians" actually engaged in a firefight with the IDF in a crowded urban area to stop the hostage rescue should probably give us pause and remind us what we are dealing with. This is not a simple problem of needing to rescue the Palestinian people from Hamas. It runs way deeper than that.
Lets also keep in mind, as it is moving deeper into Rafah and getting intelligence where the hostages are (from Palestinians) Israel has been doing nothing but uncovering bodies. Given this, they were probably desperate to actually rescue hostages alive. As they should be.
And the fact that the far left and much of the Muslim world is reacting with such a strong "disgust' response to (((Zionists))) while being so completely agnostic to the actions taking by Palestinians/Hamas to get to this point is extremely disturbing.
The Palestinians are the ones that invaded Israel on 10/7, killing around 1,000 in absolutely brutal fashion and capturing 250 more. And have held them for 250 days and for a few months Israel is doing nothing but finding dead hostage bodies.
I want to ask some specific questions to Jalfrezi and others who might agree with him overall on the I/P issues:
1) Do you agree that people who keep hostages in their house are a fair target for the IDF, and there is nothing wrong in killing them?
2) Do you agree the above, for people who knew the hostages were kept there and didn't tell the IDF about it?
3) Do you agree in general that some (unknown, but not very small) number of women in Gaza are Hamas collaborators (and so, absolutely fair targets for the IDF)?
As I said, I think the Israeli extraction team met way more resistance than they were expecting, and the extraction did go sideways.
And the fact Palestinian "civilians" actually engaged in a firefight with the IDF in a crowded urban area to stop the hostage rescue should probably give us pause and remind us what we are dealing with. This is not a simple problem of needing to rescue the Palestinian people from Hamas. It runs way deeper tha
Serious question is how people in the camp can be so heavily armed. I thought they were all controlled before entering and camp borders were fully patrolled by IDF
Unsubstantiated rumours that in its unbated killing spree cheered on by posters here the IDF killed three Israeli hostages, including an American citizen.
Interesting if true.
pro hamas sources keep giving total casualty numbers (let's pretend they are correct, it doesn't matter much), which include the actual people who kept the hostages in chain in their homes lol, and those who shot IDF soldiers that were trying to rescue them.
But this time the feeling on social media and the general media is different. Normies here aren't buying Hamas propaganda anymore. The tweets in memory of some of the terrorists who kept the people hostage at home are being ratioed really hard.
"Doctors", "journalists" were found as the actual keepers of the hostages.
We should remember this next time jalfrezi links to some source claiming that "doctors" back from Gaza said X or Y...
Remember the terrorist with "press" clothes the other day? he was an Hamas ministry of work spokesman previously roflmao.
As I said, I think the Israeli extraction team met way more resistance than they were expecting, and the extraction did go sideways.
And the fact Palestinian "civilians" actually engaged in a firefight with the IDF in a crowded urban area to stop the hostage rescue should probably give us pause and remind us what we are dealing with. This is not a simple problem of needing to rescue the Palestinian people from Hamas. It runs way deeper tha
It could have been ten terrorists killed in this operation and the Palestine/Hamas supporters would be outraged. I bet it makes a lot of these peoples day when they read how many people/terrorists were killed. Now they get to come on to forums and spout their anti Zionist/Jew rage. Fortunately the good people of this world are celebrating this great Hostage rescue.
pro hamas sources keep giving total casualty numbers (let's pretend they are correct, it doesn't matter much), which include the actual people who kept the hostages in chain in their homes lol, and those who shot IDF soldiers that were trying to rescue them.
But this time the feeling on social media and the general media is different. Normies here aren't buying Hamas propaganda anymore. The tweets in memory of some of the terrorists who kept
The whole innocent victim narrative is unraveling quickly. The College protests/riots let the world know what Israel is dealing with. They should have known October 7th. It's funny how the whole world seems to be against Israel yet Israel continues to win.
More from the (pro-Zionist) Times, highlighting Israel's new apartheid law.
The idea of the Arab male as an explicit sexual threat to Jewish women developed in tandem with the movement of Israeli politics to the right.
Months before October 7, national attention was seized by news of the rape of a young Israeli mother by a Bedouin man in southern Israel. The horror was amplified by the fact that the victim had been assaulted in front of her own children. In the Knesset, Israel’s parliament, attention became focused on the Arab ethnicity of the assailant, although police ruled out terror as a motive.
In July 2023, the Knesset passed legislation proposed by lawmakers on the right and far right, quickly dubbed the “sexual terrorism law”, which doubled the penalty for sexual assault or harassment committed with a “nationalistic motive”.
“Clearly it means that Arab or Palestinian men who are accused of rape might be tried according to a totally different procedure from Jewish men who rape,” Aharoni says. She calls the prospect “unthinkable”, pointing out that besides the racial implication, it sought to create “a hierarchy of victimhood” among rape survivors. Israel’s Association of Rape Crisis Centres (ARCCI) fought the law, unsuccessfully, on the same grounds.
