Israel/Palestine thread

Liberman to 'Post': Israel should give Gaza to Egypt, split West Bank with Jordan
BY TOVAH LAZAROFF AND ELIAV BREUER
Published: Fri, 02 Feb 2024 11:10:35 GMT
Updated: Fri, 02 Feb 2024 11:20:26 GMT
AVIGDOR LIBERMAN: PA head Mahmoud Abbas and his people have lost control even in Ramallah. (photo credit:MARC ISRAEL SELLEM/THE JERUSALEM POST)
AVIGDOR LIBERMAN: PA head Mahmoud Abbas and his people have lost control even in Ramallah. (photo credit:MARC ISRAEL SELLEM/THE JERUSALEM POST)
DIPLOMATIC AFFAIRS: Yisrael Beytenu leader believes two-state idea is dead, war in North inevitable, Netanyahu must be replaced now without elections.
In the future, Egypt should control Gaza and Jordan should take charge of Area A of the West Bank and a small portion of Area B, Yisrael Beytenu Party head MK Avigdor (Yvet) Liberman told The Jerusalem Post, as he laid out his vision of how Israel’s borders would look without a Palestinian state.

“We understand that this idea of a two-state solution [to the Israeli-Palestinian conflict] has died. It does not exist,” Liberman said, as he sat behind his desk in his Knesset office.

“We need another approach,” Liberman said, as he explained that it is illogical to “do the same thing for many years and to expect different results.”

Liberman, whose party is in the opposition, spoke out as Israel is under intense diplomatic pressure to accept a two-state resolution, once the Israel-Hamas war is over.

A maverick diplomatic and political right-wing centrist thinker, Liberman has always had an alternative vision when it came to Palestinian statehood. A native of Moldova, Liberman immigrated to Israel in 1978 and lives in the Judean settlement of Nokdim.

MK AVIGDOR LIBERMAN – framed by forefathers Ze’ev Jabotinsky and Theodor Herzl – in Modi’in, 2022. (credit: FLASH90)
MK AVIGDOR LIBERMAN – framed by forefathers Ze’ev Jabotinsky and Theodor Herzl – in Modi’in, 2022. (credit: FLASH90)
Some of Liberman’s thinking was classic for a right-wing politician. He began his prominent political life in 1993 as the director-general of the Likud Party and then in 1996 as the director-general of Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu’s Office during his first term. From that position, he was an active opponent of the Oslo Accords, which set Israel on the path to a two-state agreement.

Liberman quit his post in 1997, believing that Netanyahu had made too many concessions to the Palestinians, entering the Knesset only in 1999 as the head of the Yisrael Beytenu Party which he created.

Liberman took his party out of the government in 2004 to protest the Disengagement Plan that would lead Israel to withdraw from Gaza a year later.

The veteran politician made headlines in 2004, however, by coming out in favor of two states, based on a territorial map that focused on retaining a maximum amount of Jewish citizens and a minimal amount of Israeli-Arab ones by redrawing boundary lines.

Now, 18 years later in the aftermath of the October 7 Hamas massacre in southern Israel, in which 1,200 people were killed and 253 taken hostage, he understands that this vision was a mistake.

A new vision for Israeli-Palestinian peace after the October 7 massacre
Although Liberman prides himself on standing out from the crowd, he points out that he is hardly the only one who has changed his position on the conflict, noting that this includes former US secretary of state Henry Kissinger.

In a December 2023 interview given to the US-based website Politico in the last days before his death, Kissinger said that a two-state resolution was no longer viable and that Jordan should resume control of the West Bank, which it had held from 1948-1967.

Kissinger told Politico, “I believe the West Bank should be put under Jordanian control rather than aim for a two-state solution, which leaves one of the two territories determined to overthrow Israel.”

Liberman said he would now want to return to the idea of “a confederation between Jordan and the Palestinians.” He recalled that Area C of the West Bank is divided into three sections. Areas A and B are under the auspices of the Palestinian Authority and Area C, where all the settlements are located, is under IDF military and civilian control.

Under Liberman’s plan, “all of Area A and a small portion of B” would be under Jordanian control through a confederation, while Israel would apply sovereignty to the remainder of Area B and all of Area C.

Israel has paid a heavy price for Oslo, Liberman said. “Many thousands of Israelis were killed and injured. Everyone should ask themselves is your situation now better than before 1993, or not,” Liberman said.

His answer is a negative one, he said.

“As one who has lived for many years in Judea and Samaria, a settler like [myself], realizes that every day the situation is worsening compared to what it was in 1993,” he said.

It’s easy to point fingers at the Right, he said, but one has to ask why dovish politicians like former foreign minister Tzipi Livni and former prime minister Ehud Olmert, of the Kadima Party, failed.

It’s impossible to offer more than Olmert did during the US-led 2007 Annapolis process, Liberman stated.

Olmert was ready to divide Jerusalem and withdraw to the pre-1967 lines, but Palestinian Authority President Mahmoud Abbas refused, Liberman recalled.

“Why? Because of only one issue,” Liberman said, which was the insistence that it be a final agreement with no future demands.

Abbas wouldn’t stand for that contingency and “I do not see any other Palestinian leader in the future who would be ready to sign.”

That is only some of the issues, Liberman noted, as he charged that the PA is corrupt and unable to govern. The PA does “not know what governance is,” he said.

“Abu Mazen (Abbas) and his people have lost control even in Ramallah,” Liberman stated. “The time has come to tell the Palestinians that the idea is finished. You missed your opportunity.”

When it comes to Gaza, Liberman had often been a loud voice calling for the IDF to reestablish security control. Upon becoming defense minister in 2016, he presented Netanyahu with a document warning of a potential October 7-style attack. He then quit his post in 2018 to protest a truce reached between Israel and Hamas after an intensive barrage of rockets fired by the terrorist group against Israel.

Now he thinks that Israel should cut all its ties with Gaza, a territory that he believes should be placed back under Egyptian rule.

“At the end of the day the Egyptians should take control .. of the Gaza Strip as a mandate of the UN and the Arab League,” he said.

“We don’t have any other choice. All other proposals that I saw.. are not realistic. They are mission impossible.”

Liberman is particularly opposed to any plans for the Palestinian Authority to regain control of the enclave after the war. Israel had already handed Gaza to the PA in 2005 only to watch Hamas oust its Fatah party in a bloody coup in 2007, he noted.

Hamas “eliminated all the Fatah operatives and their key figures, some of them received refuge in Israel, and some of them were killed in Gaza.

“To speak today as if the PA can take control of Hamas is non-realistic,” Liberman said.

Abbas and his Fatah Party already rely heavily on IDF support in the West Bank, he explained.

Liberman has been frustrated by calls by the international community against Palestinians leaving Gaza for Egypt, explaining that all those who want to, should be able to head at the very least to Sinai.

The international community and moderate Arab states should invest in the construction of a new city for Palestinians in that peninsula, which could also revitalize the area, Liberman explained. This can be accompanied by industrial and manufacturing zones, he said.

Irrespective of who takes control of Gaza, he said, all goods that enter the enclave should go via Egypt and not through Israel. The international community and the Palestinians have opposed such a move in the past, so as to preserve the link between the West Bank and Gaza, fearing connecting the enclave with Egypt harmed the potential for Palestinian statehood.

“I don’t understand why we’re using the Ashdod Port again for [Gaza’s] goods and needs when there is Al-Arish Port in Egypt. Everything that they need, please bring through Al-Arish,” he said.

Liberman is among those who believe that Israel should not be providing Gaza Palestinians with humanitarian aid, arguing that it robs the government of an important pressure lever to ensure the return of the hostages.

“We lost all our leverage. If they have everything, food, fuel, and water, how can you pressure them?” he said. “All the humanitarian assistance strengthens Hamas,” Liberman said.

On Thursday he went down to the Kerem Shalom crossing, through which trucks of goods have been entering Gaza, and called for the crossing to be closed.

“It’s immoral,” he said, as pointed to the agreement under which Israel expanded the amount of medical aid to Gaza, in exchange for an agreement from Hamas that medicine would be given to the over 100 captives held there. No proof of the drug delivery was ever provided.

“To this day we have not seen any proof that the medicines intended for our captives actually reached them. It cannot be that humanitarian aid is only for one side, when our side does not have any. The Israeli government has failed in protecting Israeli citizens, and now in dealing with the hostages,” he said.

When it comes to errors Liberman, a bitter opponent of Netanyahu’s, said that he also has issues with how the IDF tactically entered Gaza.

It was a mistake from the start, he said, to engage in a unilateral military campaign rather than a multiple-lateral one. The IDF should have tackled both northern Gaza and seized control of the buffer zone by the Egyptian border called the Philadelphi corridor at the same time, rather than waiting toward the later part of the campaign, he claimed.

That corridor is “open for smugglers working for Hamas,” Liberman said so that arms could still enter the area during the war.

“It’s like trying to mop up a spill while the water is still running,” he said.

He joined the government in calling for the dismantlement of the United Nations Relief and Works Agency, which services 5.9 million Palestinian refugees. It has become a humanitarian service provider in Gaza, keeping Palestinians in permanent refugee status since 1948.

Israel has charged that 12 of its staff members actively participated in the October 7 massacre. UNRWA is part of Hamas and 190 of its employees are affiliated with the terrorist group.

Liberman went one step further, painting the agency with broad brush strokes for its involvement with Hamas. “They not only collaborated with Hamas, all the people working UNRWA have close ties with Hamas,” he said.

Hamas knows when goods enter Gaza from Rafah and Kerem Shalom and “they immediately take in their hands everything and it’s clear that today, humanitarian assistance only strengthens Hamas.”

To get out of the military crisis, Liberman said, Israel has to replace Netanyahu.

“The problem with Netanyahu is that there is only one issue – elections and how to survive politically,” Liberman charged. The “crazy” budget proposed by the government is an example of the prime minister’s prioritization of preserving his coalition, as are the decisions being made in the running of the war, Liberman said.

But Liberman opposed going to an election at the moment. An election brings about tensions and infighting, and wartime is the wrong time for this, he argues. In addition, as long as Minister Benny Gantz and MK Gadi Eisenkot remain in the government, Netanyahu enjoys wide backing, and an election isn’t a real option. Furthermore, technically an election cannot happen now – as hundreds of thousands of Israelis are still serving within the Gaza Strip or are far from their homes.

“How will soldiers in Khan Yunis cast their votes? How will people from Metulla and Kiryat Shmona vote?” Liberman said.

Liberman believes that Netanyahu should resign and should have done so already. But seeing as the prime minister isn’t considering this, a second reality would be if Netanyahu is removed without an election. This can happen via a procedure called “constructive non-confidence,” whereby at least 61 Knesset members vote in favor of a new government.

“It’s not the right time for elections,” he said as he urged the Likud to choose another leader.

“There are a number of people within Netanyahu’s party who want to replace him,” and if the Likud wants to stay in power, more politicians will understand this, Liberman said. If it sticks with Netanyahu, it will lose power.

Liberman added that he does not back anyone specific in the Likud as a successor to Netanyahu, but that the most important thing is that the prime minister is replaced.

“[Netanyahu] took the country into a deadlock, and he is not willing to recognize his responsibility for what happened on October 7,” Liberman said.

Following the Second Lebanon War and the Winograd Committee, then-opposition leader Netanyahu said that then-prime minister Ehud Olmert holds utmost responsibility in matters of national security. The same is true for Netanyahu now, after the catastrophe of October 7, Liberman said.

Moreover, Liberman claims that the prime minister doesn’t have a clear plan or vision about what victory actually is and how to solve the security situation in the North, which he said is more of a strategic threat than Gaza. The problem is not the IDF’s capabilities to fight on two fronts and defeat Hezbollah – the problem is the political leadership that is not taking initiative, Liberman argues.

The Yisrael Beytenu chairman shrugged off a question about whether he himself wants to become prime minister, as he has said in the past. What matters is the vision and the direction Israel is headed, and under Netanyahu it is heading in the wrong direction, he said. Pressed, however, Liberman says that he is the only politician who has served as defense minister, foreign minister, and finance minister – and that this makes him qualified for the job. The country also needs someone who knows how to be a manager, a “go-getter” who get things done – and Liberman views himself as such a person. Still, taking the helm has always been an “option, not an obsession,” Liberman insists.

“To speak frankly, my biggest worry is what kind of country we will have in 10, 12 years,” Liberman said. “Today it is clear to everyone that we are in the wrong direction.

“We are facing questions that we haven’t faced since ‘48, and people have no hope.”•

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