The costs of trans visibility
Yesterday, Dylan Mulvaney broke her silence: https://www.tiktok.com/@dylanmulvaney/vi....
For context, this is a trans influencer who built a 10 million strong following on TikTok. She took a brand deal with budweiser to post an ad on an instagram, and the anti-trans right went absolutely ballistic, calling for a boycott, condemning the company, and to some perhaps unknowable degree it influenced that Budweiser sales dropped by a 1/4 and
. Dylan speaks more personally about the effect of the hatred on her.
What strikes me about this story is that it is just about visibility. This isn't inclusion in sports or gender-affirming care for minors, it was just that a trans person was visible. This wasn't even visibility in a TV commerical that a poor right-winger is forced to see, it was an ad on her own instagram page. We're all in our own social media algorithm influenced bubbles, but from my vantage point it really has seemed that in the last year or so things have just gotten worse for trans people and the backlash to even minor visibility is growing.
We need to do better.
Yeah this isn’t rocket science.
Testosterone = performance enhancing
Lack of Testosterone = performance degradation
Except you discriminate against people was lack of testosterone based on your perception of sec. By definition it’s discrimination
And that’s fine. But I can freely point out your whole lot is objectively discriminatory
No I don't discriminate against people who lack testosterone.
I discriminate against minors who take puberty blockers to "change sex" because that option should be fully illegal, and not rewarded.
I try to do the most I can to avoid healthy minors being devastated by radical leftist ideology
These two posts are a pretty good example of the framing issue. There is one side (to mirror the language, let's call them anti-trans activists and anti-trans ideologues) which likes to frame the debate as being about "basic scientific facts" or "evidence". But on the core substance of the issue, there is really very little disagreement about any scientific facts. Like when a trans man says they are a man, it is sort of silly to interpret d
Good post, except some extremists monsters on your side actually do disagree on facts as well (you don't, so you don't have to defend that, but you have to be aware some people on your left do)
This is quite literally what I’m talking about. Lia didn’t decide to switch to the females division, she underwent hormone therapy to become a female. The female sports part is only a factor to bigots.
It’s a distinct ignorance to motivation that makes it seem like Lia transitioned to be a more successful swimmer. It’s trash to be completely frank
How do you know what motivation was behind the switch? How is it ignorance or bigotry to guess differently than you do?
It's ignorant to not know the facts, it's bigotry when you disregard the known facts, then make up and assert a derogatory motive instead. Congratulations on exhibiting both.
These two posts are a pretty good example of the framing issue. There is one side (to mirror the language, let's call them anti-trans activists and anti-trans ideologues) which likes to frame the debate as being about "basic scientific facts" or "evidence". But on the core substance of the issue, there is really very little disagreement about any scientific facts. Like when a trans man says they are a man, it is sort of silly to interpret d
The trans movement believes a trans person is the "gender" they claim to be. So the term man or woman have no basis in anything scientific, but instead gender ideology. This isn't only their own words but they act it out as well. This is why men are forcing their way in to womens sports, bathrooms, change rooms, shelters for the abused, prisons, and of course demanding you address them as their self determined identity (or have a mega meltdown. Or have the government enforce it through the human rights code)
Gender ideology is made up. It has no scientific evidence behind it. It's just nonsensical ideology
I can prove it by asking you a handful of simple questions. The fact you or anyone in the pro trans camp won't answer in good faith is the most likely outcome but feel free to surprise everyone
1) What is a woman? How does your definition differ from the typical trans activist if at all?
I’ve felt like you guys haven’t been trying the whole time. Reject reality constantly to fit your **** tier opinions because that is easiest
Same question goes to you
1) What is a woman? How does your definition differ from the typical trans activist if at all?
Since you haven't answered my first question, I'll also repeat that brain buster for you. How and why should you treat a trans person insisting on "gender affirming care" different than someone who is anorexic. What are the key differences in their conditions?
i haven't seen anyone arguing that lia transitioned to win more swim meets - if people here do believe that then i'd strongly disagree with that
Here is a recent and an older quote from chillrob arguing Lia transitioned to win more at swimming. And to get attention.
I think it's much more likely this person realized that winning in the men's events wasn't going to happen so decided to make the switch than that Lia suddenly had the realization she was a woman in the middle of a middling swimming career.
Of course, there is also the possibility she just wanted attention.
We know you are just making it up. Only you seem to miss this, even with your women's intuition.
No, they aren't really in tension. Trans athletes are able to compete in the open division and nobody is going to say anything about it.
You want to force them into a league of sports that was created and maintained for girls, which they are not by the definition upon which those leagues were built, and that has nothing to do with inclusivity. It wasn't meant for them. Go compete in the open division with the rest of the testosterone cr
Ok. This is all pretty meh, but I think it illustrates the original point, which is that you are disagreeing with me on a question of values and how to resolve different desires from different people that are in conflict and which way you want to "force" people. My original point was that this isn't a fundamental disagreement about the basic facts of the matter.
Here is a recent and an older quote from chillrob arguing Lia transitioned to win more at swimming. And to get attention.
This is quite common. I'm not quite sure why the anti-trans activists ITT are so insistent that when someone transitions, it is actually for a nefarious reason to win where they couldn't before. I suppose it is going to be hard to ever prove that is necessarily false, but the simplest explanation is that the person who says they are trans actually is trans, and their goal wasn't to become the most hated trans athlete on the planet through some evil ruse.
She, her coach and teammates gave a ton of interviews about it but chillrob just makes **** up.
The trans movement believes a trans person is the "gender" they claim to be. So the term man or woman have no basis in anything scientific, but instead gender ideology. This isn't only their own words but they act it out as well. This is why men are forcing their way in to womens sports, bathrooms, change rooms, shelters for the abused, prisons, and of course demanding you address them as their self determined identity (or have a mega meltd
This is another good illustration of my point. You are getting mad at language and the use of a "term". That isn't a disagreement about any scientific facts. Or, maybe there is a bit, let's see. You claim "gender ideology" is made up - well you put the word ideology in there and that word usually connotates bad things. Do you think "gender" is made up too?
This is another good illustration of my point. You are getting mad at language and the use of a "term". That isn't a disagreement about any scientific facts. Or, maybe there is a bit, let's see. You claim "gender ideology" is made up - well you put the word ideology in there and that word usually connotates bad things. Do you think "gender" is made up too?
Yes.
(On behalf of Luckbox)
This is another good illustration of my point. You are getting mad at language and the use of a "term". That isn't a disagreement about any scientific facts. Or, maybe there is a bit, let's see. You claim "gender ideology" is made up - well you put the word ideology in there and that word usually connotates bad things. Do you think "gender" is made up too?
It's just nonsensical ideology
I can prove it by asking you a handful of simple questions. The fact you or anyone in the pro trans camp won't answer in good faith is the most likely outcome but feel free to surprise everyone
1) What is a woman? How does your definition differ from the typical trans activist if at all?
Believe it or not, I dont actually see in to the future. There's a reason you're so predictable. I can ask you one of the most basic questions imaginable and predict you'll refuse to answer.
Try your hardest to answer the question please. It shouldn't cause too many thinky pains. You can do it
Yes the term and present use of "gender" is made up nonsense. Start with question 1 and I'll hold your hand through this.
It's pretty obvious that a person with a male body who has the desire to enter women's competitions, kick the crap out of everyone and ruin the events has some sort of mental/personality problem.
It's like trying to compete in the little league world series as an adult because you're a leap year baby.
I think part of the reason the movement is so deranged is that it is a magnet for such people. Like, middle class white kids who want to gain currency by going from the oppressor categories to
oppressed, by claiming they are non binary or whatever.
This creates a selection bias. It's like an American Indian movement driven by white people who claimed to be part NA for personal gain.
how did we even start talking about motives in the first place
if you rob a bank for the lolz vs robbing it to feed your family you still robbed a bank
It's pretty obvious that a person with a male body who has the desire to enter women's competitions, kick the crap out of everyone and ruin the events has some sort of mental/personality problem.
It's like trying to compete in the little league world series as an adult because you're a leap year baby.
I think part of the reason the movement is so deranged is that it is a magnet for such people.
beginning to understand a bit more why you guys are focused on motives
the bolded has 100% been going on for a while - i'd say non binary is probably the newer version of this
as usual, southpark nails it
The question is definitely too difficult for you. That's for sure. Feel free to shock the world
Gender ideology is made up. It has no scientific evidence behind it. It's just nonsensical ideology
I can prove it by asking you a handful of simple questions. The fact you or anyone in the pro trans camp won't answer in good faith is the most likely outcome but feel free to surprise everyone
1) What is a woman? How does your definition differ from the typical trans activist if at all?
