Moderation Questions and General Chat Thread
The last iteration of the moderation discussion thread was a complete disaster. Numerous attempts to keep it on topic failed, and it became a general discussion thread with almost no moderation related posts at all. And those that were posted were so buried in non-mod posts that it became a huge time drain on the mods to sort through them. Then, when off topic posts were deleted posters complained about that.
This led to the closing of the mod discussion thread, replaced by the post report/pm approach. This has filtered out lots of noise, but has resulted at times in the General Discussion Thread turning into a quasi-mod thread. This is not desirable, but going back to the old mod thread is also not a workable option.
Therefore, I have created this new moderation thread, but with a different purpose and ground rules than previous mod threads. The purpose of this thread is to provide a place for posters to pose questions to the mods about how policies are applied; to bring to the mods attention posts they think are inappropriate and reach the level of requiring mod action; and for mods to communicate to posters things like changes or clarifications to policies, bannings, etc.
Now let me tell you what this thread is NOT a place for. It is not for nonmoderation related posts, even if the discussion originates from a comment in in a mod related post. It is not for posters to post their opinions about other posters or whether a poster should be banned. It is not to rehash past grievances about mod decisions from months or years ago. The focus of this thread will be recent posts that require action now. Or questions about current policies and enforcement.
So basically, this is a thread to ask mods questions. Which means, pretty much that only mods should be answering those questions. If a poster asks why a particular post was deleted or allowed, only a mod can answer that. Everyone else who wants to jump in with their opinion or their mod war story needs to stay out of it. It just increases the noise to signal ratio and does nothing to answer the question.
Everyone needs to understand that this thread has very different rules than the old mod thread and any other thread. Any non-moderation post will be deleted on sight. Not moved to the appropriate thread, just deleted. So don't waste your time crafting a masterpiece post about wars or transgender issues or the presidential election and then post it in this thread. It will be gone. Also, this isnt a thread for general commentary about our mods performance. Posting "browser sucks as a mod" or any such posts that don't actually ask about a policy or request a mod action will be deleted. Everyone is entitled to their opinion about the moderation of this forum. But this thread isnt for complaining about mods. You are free to go to the ATF forum and make your concerns about modding in this forum there.
So with that intro, this thread is open for those who need to bring questions about mod policies or bring inappropriate posts to the mods attention. Again, it is NOT a thread for group discussions about other posters or for other posters to answer questions directed to mods.
We'll see how this goes. If you have what you feel is an open issue raised in the General Discussion Thread, please copy that post or otherwise reintroduce the issue here.
Thanks.
Arrests of Israel-Hamas war protesters exceed 2,300
By Associated Press and Spectrum News Staff New York City
PUBLISHED 12:54 PM ET May 03, 2024
Police ordered pro-Palestinian protesters to abandon a tent encampment at New York University early Friday, following weeks of demonstrations and police crackdowns at college campuses nationwide that have resulted in more than 2,300 arrests.
legal and illegal doesn't equal right and wrong
for most of history slavery was legal, so was genocide, so was rape(husbands raping wives, owners raping slaves)
right now it's legal to destroy the planet with pollution, and nuclear bombs.. in usa
it's legal for cops to kill black people
it's legal for judges to take bribes, politicians to take bribes, capitalists to profit from putting kids in cages
The legal local referenve was used to define what would be an unbiased moderation: to only censor what creates legal risks in your jurisdiction, and nothing else.
If instead you apply your own value preferences to what you are moderating you are moderating in a biased way.
The fact that you agree with the bias currently (which doesn't surprise me because the bias is extremely to the left) doesn't change that.
I was in fact claiming such a moderation bias currently exists in this forum.
That mildly racist comments are censored but actual Hamas propaganda isn't is an exceptional bias for me.
You might think it's the proper set of rules anyway, still extremely biased toward a value system that doesn't at all represent the median American (or european or asian for that matter), but rather a very leftist ideology mindset for which writing
/"i think ethnic group X is bad because they do Y which is bad a lot more than other ethnic groups"
Is a lot worse than
/Hamas is a legitimate resistance group and 10 7 wasn't terrorism, rather an act of war
Many people would agree to censor both comments, some would agree to censor neither, but exclusively very leftist people would agree to censor the first one but not the second one
The legal local referenve was used to define what would be an unbiased moderation: to only censor what creates legal risks in your jurisdiction, and nothing else.
If instead you apply your own value preferences to what you are moderating you are moderating in a biased way.
The fact that you agree with the bias currently (which doesn't surprise me because the bias is extremely to the left) doesn't change that.
I was in fact claiming such a mode
America is an incredibly right wing country, even by European(racist empire) standards
Americans view people like George washington as heroic. the man owned slaves and carried out genocide on indigenous people.
Americans think we need more people in prison, even though we have by far the largest prison population the world has ever seen
you're just so wrong about left/right bias(and about a million other things), that I need to take a break from talking to you
America is an incredibly right wing country, even by European(racist empire) standards
Americans view people like George washington as heroic. the man owned slaves and carried out genocide on indigenous people.
Americans think we need more people in prison, even though we have by far the largest prison population the world has ever seen
you're just so wrong about left/right bias(and about a million other things), that I need to take a break f
For some things it's rightwing (on economics for ex) for others it's to the left.
For example most European countries are way more racist (using leftist definitions of the word) that America.
Cannabis is legal in a lot of american states but in very few European countries.
Almost no European country afaik has no questions asked free abortion up to the day of childbirth (unlike some democrat led states which do).
In proportion to the exceptionally high crime rate the USA has, jail population isn't high at all compared to other first world countries.
A lot more minors got their body changed by physicians because they felt they are of the opposite sex in the USA than in the EU, even if the EU population is larger.
But all this doesn't matter at all when Hamas propaganda is allowed but very mild racism isn't. That's (radical) leftism according to any definition.
Filthy, what are your top 3 countries and why? - in your opinion, not by googling other idiot talking points.
Anyway, I’m here for the “very mild racism” argument. Shoot your shot.
Which argument? I think people should be allowed to claim they dislike a culture or ethnic group for any reason and until/unless they explicitly ask to harm them because of that, that wouldn't even be racism (or if it is, almost everyone is a racist so who cares?).
I also think that if saying some cultures are barbaric ie behave like animals more than others in some context (something the vast majority of human beings believe) is not allowed, which is even less racist than the above, that can really only come out of leftist ideology, because everyome who isnt a leftist isn't a 100% cultural relativists who denies some cultures are better than others
To be clear
I'm on a timeout for a "personal attack" for saying i lost respect for someone who is denying rapes and not believing jewish women right? If i made another "personal attack"please let me know
I don’t censor the Israeli propaganda either.
I DO moderate racism from both sides, and that’s not going to change.
You do moderate racism under the all-encompassing radical leftist definition of the word which denies it's even possible to rank cultures, to ever compare them claiming one is better than another.
And already using RACISM to define a criticism of a CULTURE is leftist.
For many people unless it's about groups DNA it literally, definitionally, can't be racism.
And you also don't allow criticism of religious practices which is an even wider form of protection that race or culture.
Again denying religions can be compared qualitatively is extremism
To be clear
I'm on a timeout for a "personal attack" for saying i lost respect for someone who is denying rapes and not believing jewish women right? If i made another "personal attack"please let me know
Now you're on a ban for a week because no amount of polite requests, stern warnings, or light corrections seem to have any effect on getting you to stop, and I've had enough.
Now you're on a ban for a week because no amount of polite requests, stern warnings, or light corrections seem to have any effect on getting you to stop, and I've had enough.
CN, would it be possible to point to the post that Mets made that resulted in you giving him his "time out?" There were four or five made back to back, but I can't rightly tell which one you are considering a personal attack that warranted a time out and then a ban.
Luciom is not presenting his point in an elegant manner, but there is something to his overall argument that you are allowing personal biases to color your decisions regarding what constitutes a personal attack. It was pretty obvious earlier this week when you said that an obvious one from Trolly, a poster that posts literally nothing but personal attacks, wasn't posting personal attacks but what instead being "sarcastic."
You may not recognize it in yourself, but you appear to have biases toward and against certain posters and topics. That is totally fine until your mod decisions are affected by those biases. If and when that becomes obvious to everybody, the forum crumbles into a total shitshow.
You do moderate racism under the all-encompassing radical leftist definition of the word which denies it's even possible to rank cultures, to ever compare them claiming one is better than another.
And already using RACISM to define a criticism of a CULTURE is leftist.
For many people unless it's about groups DNA it literally, definitionally, can't be racism.
And you also don't allow criticism of religious practices which is an even wider form
We've already been round and round the definition of racism and ethnicity and yours doesn't agree with the dictionary or with moderators. You should learn the rules and apply them to your posting. Simple.
American culture is insulted often in this forum without that being censored, italian culture was deeply insulted recently (in our national equivalent of 4th of July nonetheless) with no action taken after reporting it so PLEASE FORGIVE ME if I don't understand why insulting some specific other cultures is instead considered racism and thus not allowed here
I can't speak for mods but the US is highly culturally and ethnically diverse, as is Italy according to you, remember?
I'm pretty rabidly anti israel... and anti usa
but the anti jew stuff is sickening. and I want to express a little love for my Jewish brothers and sisters. and acknowledge the disgusting racism that Jews have to endure, and have endured for thousands of years
and I love USA too... it's my home. many many fantastic things about USA culture and people, and even govt and corporations!
i've never been to israel, but I'm sure many many fantastic things about Israel too, just like usa
and growing up in a Jewish community, i've experienced first hand the love of Jewish people and culture. the humor! compassion, wisdom, LOVE... I really value Jewish people and culture, as we all should
I'm pretty rabidly anti israel... and anti usa
but the anti jew stuff is sickening. and I want to express a little love for my Jewish brothers and sisters. and acknowledge the disgusting racism that Jews have to endure, and have endured for thousands of years
Don't you think governments in democratic countries actually pretty well reflect the character of that country (at least in the moment the photograph is taken, during elections)?
I can't speak for mods but the US is highly culturally and ethnically diverse, as is Italy according to you, remember?
I said Italy is super diverse ethnically, and there are cultural differences, but the attack was about mafia being an ingrained element of Italian culture (which it isn't), and that's objectively wrong exactly because of those differences, because it's exclusively a very specific southern Italy thing (and only in some specific regions of the south).
It would be like someone insulting ALL Americans because the Texas governor pardoned the racist guy who point blank assassinated the BLM protestor.
Or someone claiming ALL AMERICANS love the death penalty because a small number of states use it somewhat frequently
I said Italy is super diverse ethnically, and there are cultural differences, but the attack was about mafia being an ingrained element of Italian culture (which it isn't), and that's objectively wrong exactly because of those differences, because it's exclusively a very specific southern Italy thing (and only in some specific regions of the south).
Right, so why do you think someone saying something about Italians could be racist (which was your complaint)?
Right, so why do you think someone saying something about Italians could be racist (which was your complaint)?
Because of THIS FORUM DEFINITION JFC.
So it's either I can say literally anything about Palestinians without a ban, then people can say anything about Italians as well, or no one can say anything negative about italians at all.
Or, there is an horrific bias against western cultures such that horrible insults against them are allowed, while any negative criticism of other cultures is a bannable offense.
Which is like wokism wants thing to be to be clear
