The costs of trans visibility
Yesterday, Dylan Mulvaney broke her silence: https://www.tiktok.com/@dylanmulvaney/vi....
For context, this is a trans influencer who built a 10 million strong following on TikTok. She took a brand deal with budweiser to post an ad on an instagram, and the anti-trans right went absolutely ballistic, calling for a boycott, condemning the company, and to some perhaps unknowable degree it influenced that Budweiser sales dropped by a 1/4 and
. Dylan speaks more personally about the effect of the hatred on her.
What strikes me about this story is that it is just about visibility. This isn't inclusion in sports or gender-affirming care for minors, it was just that a trans person was visible. This wasn't even visibility in a TV commerical that a poor right-winger is forced to see, it was an ad on her own instagram page. We're all in our own social media algorithm influenced bubbles, but from my vantage point it really has seemed that in the last year or so things have just gotten worse for trans people and the backlash to even minor visibility is growing.
We need to do better.
There's not much of a conversation to be had here if you're going to take a nuanced issue and simplify it all down to "deferring to parents" and "keeping the actions of minors secret", and based on that, calling my post "reality distortion stuff".
There's more than just parents involved here. Should there not be some consideration of the needs of the students? A 17 year old student is looking for some support, shares some private informatio
bobo you're advocating for 1984, you just don't realize that because it's a version of 1984 that you approve of
no, this has nothing to do with that
the government has no evidence of parental malfeasance and therefore has no obligation to act as if that is the case
the word of a minor who has numerous genuine reasons to not want parental disclosure is not to be taken as gospel
this is a parental responsibility and you can't just exclude them from the process just because there's a non-zero chance they could be awful parents
students need written document
So in your mind sexual orientation is akin to .... watching a movie?
Kids need parental permission to identify as trans or non binary?
Again, there is a fundamental constitutional right for individuals to not speak
So in your mind sexual orientation is akin to .... watching a movie?
Kids need parental permission to identify as trans or non binary?
Again, there is a fundamental constitutional right for individuals to not speak
this is a parenting/family issue and should be handled as such
we can't just assume bad parents etc
yes it is, you just don't acknowledge it because it's a form of government control you are supportive of
same way that the january 6ers genuinely don't think they did anything wrong and view themselves as saviors and not insurrectionists
simply put, you never get totalitarian governments without broad public support for it - go look at most regimes from china to russia and north korea and the people all overwhelmingly support the government and believe they are acting in the best interest of the people
bobo you're advocating for 1984, you just don't realize that because it's a version of 1984 that you approve of
Apparently I could have just stopped here:
A little disappointing as you're usually capable of actual discussion, but here we are.
this is a parenting/family issue and should be handled as such
we can't just assume bad parents etc
yes it is, you just don't acknowledge it because it's a form of government control you are supportive of
same way that the january 6ers genuinely don't think they did anything wrong and view themselves as saviors and not insurrectionists
simply put, you never get totalitarian governments without broad public support for it - go look at most regi
January 6ers can "think they did(n't) do anything wrong" but many of them ended up convicted so thats a stupid ****ing example
More than 1,230 people have been charged with federal crimes in the riot, ranging from misdemeanor offenses like trespassing to felonies like assaulting police officers and seditious conspiracy. Roughly 730 people have pleaded guilty to charges, while another roughly 170 have been convicted of at least one charge at a trial decided by a judge or a jury, according to an Associated Press database.
Only two defendants have been acquitted of all charges, and those were trials decided by a judge rather than a jury.
About 750 people have been sentenced, with almost two-thirds receiving some time behind bars. Prison sentences have ranged from a few days of intermittent confinement to 22 years in prison.
Claiming that sexual orientation is a parenting/family thing is like saying a child having black friends is a parenting/family thing.
No, its an individual choice and parents don't get a say in someone's personal beliefs and choices that aren't harmful. If you are claiming that Trans people are harmful then our ideology is fully incompatible.
When republicans talk about wokism run amok and all that, it keeps seeming that trans issues end up being the best/worst archetype example of this. Take republican narratives about the left swinging way to the left and going crazy - remove trans issues from that and the list becomes pretty ****ing narrow.
I tried to agree with this by describing GOP strategy bluntly.
GOP is cooking up hundreds of policies that are not nice to trans people.
Democrats don't have much explicit policy with regard to trans.
I think religious people have always have kids and maybe abused them in various ways from an outside observers perspective.
There are religious people who don't vaccinate.
LGBT folks have always had to remain closeted and GOP doesn't want that to change.
Apparently I could have just stopped here:
A little disappointing as you're usually capable of actual discussion, but here we are.
i do draw a fairly hard line when it comes to government taking a role in parenting
there's a good reason why nobody disagrees with the fact that parents can veto their kids from seeing stargate or playing football
this is no different except for you attach a greater value to this over watching movies and playing sports
i strongly dislike religion, i think it's incredibly stupid - lots of kids don't want to go to bible camp or sunday school, yet i'm not going to ever advocate the government getting in the way of intervening in that stuff even if it means a few kids will be unhappy with their parents and not speak to them as adults
the majority will be fine
and i think i really buried the lede here
we already have mechanisms to liberate parents from abusive homes - we should just stay the course with that and let parents parent until they show they aren't fit to be one
firstly, lol a rickroll who recently put me on ignore going around liking people who quote me. Classic.
But I guess you sort of confirm my thesis, somehow in the mind of the far right trans issues is the like litmus test that finally proves their insane conspiracy theories about the left
The people making a stand against encouraging gender transition in children are not the insane ones. You are not in a civil rights hero story. This is a horror story.
Should we try the “true gender” debate again or nah?
I don't really know wtf is going on anymore but are you comparing the current Democratic party to the Khmer Rouge?
no, but taking away parental decisions and deferring to the government is what the khmer rouge and other totalitarian states do and they did so with broad support where people thought the government needed to intervene
everything they did they did with good intentions
pol pot was not like "i'm going to go in there f shat up for the lols" he genuinely believed everything he did was for the good of the country and the majority of the population was behind it - so much so that they weren't even toppled from within, their neighbor vietnam took a look at them and said "we need to put an end to that" and they invaded to the country just to remove them from power and install a new government
you need to draw a line in the sand and if that means some people suck and are bad parents then that is the fallout for living in a free society
look at it this way
there are people with bacne out there who don't ever want to take their shirts off in public places out of fear of getting ridiculed - should we mandate that everyone must wear a shirt while swimming in the pool to accomodate them?
there's far more people with bacne than people who are trans
or should we spend billions of dollars removing every flashing yellow and flashing red traffic light with one a color blind person can see the difference on?
again, there's far more color blind people than there are trans
at some point you just need to accept that we're never going to have a fair and equitable society and after a certain point, any steps taken to make it so, regardless of how good intentioned they are - eventually lead to the khmer rouge
I don't really know wtf is going on anymore but are you comparing the current Democratic party to the Khmer Rouge?
These people left reality ages ago. Transgender people pose no threat whatsoever to their comfort but they've still whipped themselves into a frenzy over the existence of transgender people because that's what Fox News has told them to think.
look at it this way
there are people with bacne out there who don't ever want to take their shirts off in public places out of fear of getting ridiculed - should we mandate that everyone must wear a shirt while swimming in the pool to accomodate them?
there's far more people with bacne than people who are trans
or should we spend billions of dollars removing every flashing yellow and flashing red traffic light with one a color blind person can
Stop it, get some help.
ding ding ding - you want to remove parenting simply because some parents are bad
What's really confusing is it sounds like people are claiming Democrats are actively doing something and being woke or whatever. The reality is GOP are crafting hundreds of laws against American citizens who are LBGT and trying to insert themselves into everyone's home. GOP "freedom" is legislating against trans people and their families.
You’re just talking a bunch of nonsense. People with bacne are free to literally never take a shirt off. Like, they can shower, ****, shave, sleep, swim, and sex in a shirt if they want. That’s actually what freedom looks like. Mandating that everyone swim with a shirt on or off would be totalitarian.
Just like forcing a teacher to do something would be totalitarian.
Freedom is having a choice.
The Khmer Rouge never tried to be equitable. They were totalitarian.
Like I said, it’s just complete nonsense and so ****ing backwards I’m half thinking you are just lazily trolling
i do draw a fairly hard line when it comes to government taking a role in parenting
there's a good reason why nobody disagrees with the fact that parents can veto their kids from seeing stargate or playing football
this is no different except for you attach a greater value to this over watching movies and playing sports
This is a really strange equivalence you're trying to draw here. Your examples are of kids wanting to engage in some kind of school activity that it has been decided is high risk enough to require parental permission. What you're comparing this to is a kid who is gay confiding in a teacher, and the teacher not being required to breach this confidence. I'm not following the equivalency, nor am I seeing how this is the government taking a role in parenting.
And most importantly, I'm not seeing the point in this. As I mentioned previously, requiring a teacher to report these things does nothing for the parents - the kids simply won't tell their teachers. So all this is doing is removing options for these kids to find a supportive adult, for zero gain. Why?
What's really confusing is it sounds like people are claiming Democrats are actively doing something and being woke or whatever. The reality is GOP are crafting hundreds of laws against American citizens who are LBGT and trying to insert themselves into everyone's home. GOP "freedom" is legislating against trans people and their families.
None of these people gave a rip about transgender people before the GOP decided to make it a wedge issue. Hell, they still barely understand what trans people even are, but they know they're supposed to rage against them.
This is a really strange equivalence you're trying to draw here. Your examples are of kids wanting to engage in some kind of school activity that it has been decided is high risk enough to require parental permission. What you're comparing this to is a kid who is gay confiding in a teacher, and the teacher not being required to breach this confidence. I'm not following the equivalency, nor am I seeing how this is the government taking a ro
all that is happening when most people swim shirtless in the pool is removing options for these kids to find a supportive place to swim for zero gain. why?
I don’t know why this needs to be said but it is up to kids how and when they choose to be out to their parents. Many will wait years if they know their parents are homophobic or transphobic. It’s up to them. I’d hope they feel safe enough to share with someone else in their lives if that is the case. Like maybe a trusted teacher.
