The costs of trans visibility
Yesterday, Dylan Mulvaney broke her silence: https://www.tiktok.com/@dylanmulvaney/vi....
For context, this is a trans influencer who built a 10 million strong following on TikTok. She took a brand deal with budweiser to post an ad on an instagram, and the anti-trans right went absolutely ballistic, calling for a boycott, condemning the company, and to some perhaps unknowable degree it influenced that Budweiser sales dropped by a 1/4 and
. Dylan speaks more personally about the effect of the hatred on her.
What strikes me about this story is that it is just about visibility. This isn't inclusion in sports or gender-affirming care for minors, it was just that a trans person was visible. This wasn't even visibility in a TV commerical that a poor right-winger is forced to see, it was an ad on her own instagram page. We're all in our own social media algorithm influenced bubbles, but from my vantage point it really has seemed that in the last year or so things have just gotten worse for trans people and the backlash to even minor visibility is growing.
We need to do better.
I wasn’t trying to attack you; it was just bugging me
it was used correctly when introduced, i'll grant the second usage was a sloppy expedient
and again i don't perceive any malice in your posting and do genuinely like you
but this is just drive by posting - you're only jumping in to disparage (and vaguely at that so that itself can't even be a conversation) and not introducing anything new
I don’t want to derail the thread any further. I was just pointing something out for educational purposes. A bully pulpit is a good thing; it doesn’t make sense to use it in a pejorative context.
Anyway..
good thing is subjective
rick, "bully" used to be slang for "good." You can look this up.
again, more evidence why this is a religion and people act very differently in these threads because in their minds there's a right position and many wrong positions and thus it's fine to just attack all the "bad people"
This is not about there being a right and wrong position. It's that there's a right position and a hateful position which ruins these threads. Much like it is now. I say that posting hateful things about trans people isn't allowed and now there's just arguments about wanting to be able to do so. If instead we just focused on the issues surrounding trans people, we could have some more productive discussion here.
So Imane Khalif is a woman, except when she steps into a boxing ring, then she transitions to a man temporarily? This is all a bit odd?
My understanding is that Imane was tested genetically twice. The only stipulation was that the person needs to have XX chromosomes and Imane failed, thus suggesting Imane had XY chromosomes and is a man. He had the opportunity to appeal free of charge (the IBA offered to cover the expenses of an appeal) and chose not to, therefore accepting the results of the testing. The Olympics do not require such testing. They go by what is listed on the passport which proves nothing.
again, not banned because it's objectively wrong as it's clearly subjective
but it's banned because it is argued that someone saying they didn't believe in god only did so in order to attack christians - there's no world where you can be sympathetic and kind to christians and having no problem with them practicing their religion without also believing in it as well
it's just insane
Reading through this thread there are plenty of examples of people here opposing the pro-trans group, being respectful in doing so, posting legitimate sources that lead to their beliefs and being banned for it having done nothing to try to rile up the other side, but merely express their alternate views.
This is not about there being a right and wrong position. It's that there's a right position and a hateful position which ruins these threads. Much like it is now. I say that posting hateful things about trans people isn't allowed and now there's just arguments about wanting to be able to do so. If instead we just focused on the issues surrounding trans people, we could have some more productive discussion here.
it is demonstrably not a hateful position - you're injecting that falsehood in order to silence dissenting opinions from your own
are you an awful pos because you don't pray to krishnu? does that mean you hate all hindus?
This is not about there being a right and wrong position. It's that there's a right position and a hateful position which ruins these threads. Much like it is now. I say that posting hateful things about trans people isn't allowed and now there's just arguments about wanting to be able to do so. If instead we just focused on the issues surrounding trans people, we could have some more productive discussion here.
We could focus on the issues trans activists (not trans people, activists DO NOT REPRESENT TRANS PEOPLE and it's disgusting they claim to do so) want to push who severely damage the life of women, to try (unsuccessfully) to improve the lives of 0.1% of people who they don't represent.
I do that. And I want to be able to claim that trans activists are evil people, who push an evil ideology, predicated on completely made up assumptions, lies, and a constant attack on actual science, depending on the specific topic.
And that it's horrific for people to agree with them, it makes them bad people. Trans activist are deeply evil people who don't represent trans people and who are a scourge of society. As all Marxists are in all avenues of life.
Lil at "there is a right way and a hateful way". There are monsters, trans activists, trying to ruin the lives of everyone (including trans people) and a plethora of normal people discussing trans issues with a variety of takes.
You want to regulate discussion as if the worst opinion in society about those issues (the trans activist opinion) was a law of nature. That's our problem
This is not about there being a right and wrong position. It's that there's a right position and a hateful position which ruins these threads. Much like it is now. I say that posting hateful things about trans people isn't allowed and now there's just arguments about wanting to be able to do so. If instead we just focused on the issues surrounding trans people, we could have some more productive discussion here.
A right position and a hateful position. Such simplistic moral understanding, but this is where we are right now unfortunately.
Reading through this thread there are plenty of examples of people here opposing the pro-trans group, being respectful in doing so, posting legitimate sources that lead to their beliefs and being banned for it having done nothing to try to rile up the other side, but merely express their alternate views.
Does most if not all of human history or biology 101 count as a legitimate source?
Reading through this thread there are plenty of examples of people here opposing the pro-trans group, being respectful in doing so, posting legitimate sources that lead to their beliefs and being banned for it having done nothing to try to rile up the other side, but merely express their alternate views.
Find me one person banned for respectfully expressing alternative views on this topic.
I haven't seen this demonstrated, only the opposite. Telling trans people that they are wrong, not truly trans, that their brains are just messed up, is hateful and hurtful to trans people.
many respectful posters such as myself would be banned if we weren't forced to self censor to your absurd and subjective demands
you also demonstratably don't ban any of the people who are trolling or just being douchebags to others unless they are of a philosophical viewpoint you disagree with
just look at how the labeling of the debate has been shaped into pro and anti trans - which is just absurd framing of it
"oh you're concerned about sexual predators exploiting a loophole - something with multiple instances of happening in the real world?" = you're anti-trans
"you don't think children should transition until they can make better informed decisions as an adult?" = you're anti-trans
"you don't think trans women should be allowed to compete against women due to the unfair advantages it grants?" = you're anti-trans
none of those ideas reject trans people nor is even anti-trans - but you still frame it that way
I haven't seen this demonstrated, only the opposite. Telling trans people that they are wrong, not truly trans, that their brains are just messed up, is hateful and hurtful to trans people.
this is a straw man argument and heavily laden with bias
let me fix your post
Telling people that you think some children following indoctrination are confused is hateful and hurtful to trans people.
now let's swap out trans with religion
Telling people that you think some religious children following indoctrination are confused is hateful and hurtful to religious people.
do you finally get it? you're basically saying that because certain people believe in allah that anyone who doesn't is hateful and chooses not to believe only to hurt muslims - which is just incredibly stupid
Find me one person banned for respectfully expressing alternative views on this topic.
I haven't seen this demonstrated, only the opposite. Telling trans people that they are wrong, not truly trans, that their brains are just messed up, is hateful and hurtful to trans people.
I don't think men can be women and vice versa, there is no scientific evidence to back this claim up and goes directly against biology. Am I now being hateful and hurtful for stating what my ''scientific consensus'' tells me?
A right position and a hateful position. Such simplistic moral understanding, but this is where we are right now unfortunately.
yup, gansta's just running this as his only little fiefdom - absolutely terrifying to think this person is supposedly helping others with mental health issues
My understanding is that Imane was tested genetically twice. The only stipulation was that the person needs to have XX chromosomes and Imane failed, thus suggesting Imane had XY chromosomes and is a man. He had the opportunity to appeal free of charge (the IBA offered to cover the expenses of an appeal) and chose not to, therefore accepting the results of the testing. The Olympics do not require such testing. They go by what is listed on th
This doesn't answer my question?
Also, what if two women get into a fight in the ladies room, do they have to relocate to the gents room?
Teachers and mental health professionals are mostly radical leftists, we aren't in 1982.
Btw this is why both professions nowadays have horrible results, and even if we spend far more on both, results are a lot worse than 50 years ago.
Leftism destroys everything
many respectful posters such as myself would be banned if we weren't forced to self censor to your absurd and subjective demands
He said that such posters were banned. This response of yours implies that you agree with me that he made that up?
you also demonstratably don't ban any of the people who are trolling or just being douchebags to others unless they are of a philosophical viewpoint you disagree with
This is actually false. You apparently just don't know when I warn, message, infract, or ban posters. Also, I've let lots of mean posting go in this thread and forum from people of all political bents. But I don't allow transphobia.
just look at how the labeling of the debate has been shaped into pro and anti trans - which is just absurd framing of it
"oh you're concerned about sexual predators exploiting a loophole - something with multiple instances of happening in the real world?" = you're anti-trans
"you don't think children should transition until they can make better informed decisions as an adult?" = you're anti-trans
"you don't think trans women should be allowed
This is a complete fabrication. All those arguments have been made and allowed to stand in this thread. What is banned as anti-trans is saying that all trans people are not actually trans, that they're all faking or tricked or mentally ill. These are not the same arguments.
